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Aug 19, 2005

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How do you keep reading this stuff?

I mean, I'm grateful and everything---wouldn't miss a Left Behind Friday---but how terrible for you.

This is why everybody in LB speaks of the U.N. as an all-powerful and malevolent institution. This is also how readers who swallow the LB perspective come to think of the U.N. and or of any multilateral cooperation or treaty. Another small reminder of the way these books and their popularity influences American politics and policy.

I've always found it appaling how so many "fellow Christians" can see better international cooperation as such a bad thing.

apropos of absolutely nothing, I was wondering (you may have said, but if you did I've forgotten): did the babies disappear from the wombs of the unsaved?

Also, are the unsaved now infertile? It seems a bit Old Testament to condemn an entire generation of babies for having irreligious parents.

Is there any rational explanation for what the heck the author of revelation was talking about when he said that the "number" of the antichrist was 666?

Apparently, babies in the womb disappeared overnight, along with all kids under 12 (?14?), but this is another of those things that everyone forgets about five minutes later. After all, the Jews are coming to town!
But people can get pregnant now, if they like. On the one hand, it doesn't seem like the kindest thing to do to kids, to bring them into a world ruled by the antichrist. On the other, if they haven't been conceived, how can they get into heaven? It's just weird all over.

Apparently, however, not a single head of state was among the disappeared, so aside from Romania, every other administration remains intact. This means that every head of state is both a heathen...

Hey, L&J can't always be wrong. :-)

I was wondering that myself, Filth. And is there any historical correlation that has already come to pass (from Diocletian or Nero or some other Roman ruler) about using a Mark on hand or forehead in order to buy things?

Well, to me, the whole "marking" of people so they're allowed to buy stuff makes at least some sense. It's totalitarian control over your people, where the marked ones get to do something the unmarked don't. I wouldn't be at all surprised if something similar had occured in more than one society in the past

No reference, but Bart Ehrman's New Testament course from the Teaching Company, says 666 is a direct reference to Caesar Nero. Cant give you any detail though, maybe someone else can elaborate.

"This means that every head of state is both a heathen and an expert politician"

See, there's some realistic features of these books after all.

"Buck seems in awe of the idea that Carpathia could rise to become the next Boutros Boutros Ghali."

Funniest line of the whole piece! But hey, do you have to be rankin' on my man BBG?

"Apparently, babies in the womb disappeared overnight, along with all kids under 12 (?14?)"

Kids under 12 get in free!

Seriously though, my understanding is that there's a plywood cutout of an angel holding his arm out, with a sign that says, "You must be at least this short to go on the Rapture Ride."

I'm no numerologist, but I can't help but observe that a sampling of Roman numerals -- DCLXVI -- adds up to 666.

"If you believe that this One World Government is destined by prophecy, and that this prophecy is going to be fulfilled very soon, then you will look on any existing multilateral, international organizations -- no matter how ineffectual or marginal they may appear to be -- as the precursors of this global totalitarian reign."

Given how Pres. Bush has shown how ineffective the UN can be at its main mission (preventing invasions), I'm surprised there isn't more of a backlash against him. Y'know, for throwing a wrench into the prophetic machinery.

First, am I the only person here who continually pictures Hal Linden whenever Hal Lindsey is referenced?

Second, Ooh, Steve, you talk just like a mobster. I'm imagining Buck (who looks like Les Nessman in my head (I'm getting Buck Williams confused with the Buckeye Newshawk Award, perhaps?)) grabbing Steve's arm and shivering theatrically as he says this.

And anyhow, "dirt nap"? The only place I've ever seen this used was a friend's WWI-era novel. "Sleeping with the fishes," I can see. "Wearing cement overshoes," likewise. "Dirt nap," not so much.

As long as we're making random associations, "dirt nap" makes me think "dirty nappy," which makes me think Steve was talking more like a new mom, not a mobster.

IIRC, Roman slaves were tattooed or branded to mark their status. The implication may be that everyone will be enslaved by the Beast.

I assume the "the number of his name" refers to its numerological value. Maybe "Nero Caesar" has a value of 666. There must be other words and phrases that have the same value, so I'm not sure how you could identify the name with any certainty, but that seems like a reasonable guess.

There have been LOTS of name associations with 666. Nero has already been mentioned, though to be fair, this one tends to depend on a varient reading, where the number is actually 616 (although I'm still not sure how they get there. It seems to involved transliterating the name from Hebrew to Greek to Latin...). Caligula has been suggested for similar reasons, also depending on 616. As to the generally accepted 666 version, one theologian suggested that the initials of all the Roman emperors from Julius Caesar to Vespasian add up to 666 (admittedly omitted two to make it work).

Modern figures have been suggested, as well. My favorite is the suggestion of "Ronald Wilson Reagan" (count the letters in each name).

This Mark of the Beast stuff always ends up reminding me of Dr. Seuss's "sneetches." Specifically, the ones with "stars upon thars."

Hey! Whatever happened to the Common Market (precursor to the EU) as the one-world government? I remember hearing back in the '70s that the Common Market was it, because the organization had a computer in Belgium called "the Beast" and because it was expanding from 7? to 10 members and when it had 10 members it would be like the 10 heads of the Beast in another chapter of Revelation.

Of course, that was back in the days when barcode scanners were the Mark of the Beast (or could be) and Henry Kissinger was thought to be the Antichrist. O wait, wasn't it Anwar Sadat? My memory fails me here.

"It seems a bit Old Testament to..."

I'd like to mention that Some People (not to name names or anything) believe the document mentioned above is really called the Hebrew Bible, and some (okay, me) rather dislike hearing it used as shorthand for unrelenting and probably disproportionate punishment.
It's a little as if all you knew of the New Testament was through seeing Mel Gibson's (reputedly) gory movie, and you started saying things like "Wow, that Tarantino, he was really New Testament, wasn't he? Did you ever see Reservoir Dogs?".
Sorry, had to pipe up.

I also love your blog, BTW. Like a window into another world. Your whole voice of reason thing really gives me hope.

The number 666 is derived, according to _Asimov's Guide to the New Testament,_ from the numerical values in the Greek name for Nero, "Neron Kaisar." In ancient times, letters were used to stand for numbers (they didn't have separate symbols for numbers, as we do) and this led to a lot of weird-ball stuff. There were/are complicated systems for using the numberical values of Hebrew letters to find esoteric meanings in Hebrew writings. This is called "Gematria." Similar systems existed for Greek.

Since the number-values of letters were known to anybody literate, if you wanted to refer to someone without him necessarily twigging, you might come up with a number that could be derived from the numbers, and wrote it out.

"Romania. Nonstrategic, scant gross national product, never invaded anybody, never anyone's strategically. There's nothing there but low-level internal politics."

Apparently, L&J couldn't even be bothered to go to the library that is in LaHaye's seminary and look at the Encyclopedia entry for Romania. Romania invaded Bulgaria in 1913, the USSR and Bulgaria (allied with Nazi Germany) in 1941, and Nazi Germany in 1944 (allied with the USSR). That's just this past century. As to "never anyone's strategically" (I don't really know what that precisely means), Romania's southern border is the Danube as it enters the Black Sea. L&J, master strategists that they are, are apparently infinitely greater strategists to ignore that as opposed to the Romans, the Huns, the Ottoman Turks, the Hungarians, the Austro-Hungarians, Nazi Germany and the USSR, since all of these powers considered Romania a prime strategic target (Nazi Germany needed to secure Romania's oil supplies). Julius Caesar's upcoming campaign before his assassination was against the Dacians in what is now Romania. The Emperor Trajan spent about 5 years conquering Dacia for Rome (Trajan was the great military genuis of the time - he didn't go on 5-year campaigns because he thought it would be cool).

Since LB was written in 1992-1993, apparently L&J had already completely forgotten the dramatic Romanian Revolution of 1989 just 2 years before, which ended with Ceausescu getting shot in front of a wall (very vivid image, that).

Here again we see the hurdle facing LaHaye and Jenkins: So much prophecy, so little time. They haven't got the luxury of following up on the aftereffects of the "rapture" because they've got a rise-of-the-Antichrist to follow.

This only rings true if they didn't know at the time that this was the first book in a twelve book series, which, given the blatent greed of the whole enterprise, I find to be unlikely.

Let me see if I got this.

A whole bunch of people have vanished. Planes, trains, and automobiles have crashed killed even more people. All children under the age of 12 are gone.

So our cracker-jack reporter and his editor are discussing International Financiers (Jews), Jews (Jews), and Murder Incorporate (Jews). H'mmmm. Seems to be a trend here. Sorry Herr von Slacktypist, "The John Birch Society" is not *exactly* the political movement that immediately leaps to mind.

As far as 666 I beg to notify the reader what is obviously being refered to is Route 666 a highway found in Arizona, Utah, and New Mexico.

"[My husband] was driving this highway (in the middle of the night) headed for Gallop. He was alone and hadn’t seen a car for miles and miles. Suddenly, he saw a truck that looked like it was on fire heading straight for him, right down the middle of the highway. The truck was going so fast that sparks were flying up off the wheels and flames were coming from the smokestack. It scared him so bad that he pulled way off the road and walked 20 feet or so out into the desert away from his car and waited for the truck to pass him, going what he estimated was 130 miles an hour. He then got back into his car and continued on.

In addition to the mad trucker, packs of demon dogs have been seen on this highway as wel1. They attack at night with yellow eyes and sharp teeth; shredding the tires of those silly enough to stop along this highway at night. Then there is a beautiful, young and frail girl in a long nightgown that roams the road. People see her walking along the side of the road, all alone in the dark out in the middle of nowhere. They stop to help her and as they approach, she instantly vanishes. There are many other tales of people who either disappear along this route or suddenly appear out of nowhere. There are even tales of the same person, disappearing at one point along the highway and then reappearing at another location miles away, without having any recollection of where they have been or what they have been doing.

There are Native Americans tales of unwanted passengers appearing in the backseat of the car along such stretches of highway, but especially along Highway 666. It seems that skin walkers, or evil-minded Medicine Men, can shape shift often into animals such as crows, coyotes, or wolves and appear out of nowhere in front of your car on the highway. This, in and of itself, can cause unexplained accidents along the road. However, this is usually a warning and can happen several times before the evil shaman decides to appear in the backseat of your car, if you are driving alone."

Quoted from web article "Highway to Hell - Mysteries of Route 666 in Utah."

So Romania? The Carpathians? Pish-tosh. It's actually the Lower Rockies in which the Anti-Christ will appear.

"A fragment from the oldest surviving copy of the New Testament, dating to the Third century, gives the more mundane 616 as the mark [I think the writer means 'number'] of the Antichrist." Found online via Googling '616'.

I am deeply disappointed that the Antichrist does not turn out to be a Jewish rock 'n' roll star turned politician. "He sold his soul for Rock 'n' Roll! Vote Antichrist!"

Isn't it now 616? which is coincidently the area code for Grand Rapids, the michigan bible belt.

RONALD WILSON REAGAN = 666

There. I said it. I feel better.

the King of the South and the King of the North from Daniel

Sigh...that passage is so incredibly obviously about the wars between the Ptolemies and the Seleutcids. It's a pretty detailed recounting of the stuff.

"6! 6-6!
THE NUM - BER OF THE BEAST!"

I'm reminded of a punk band in my old high school who had a song, the chorus of which was something like: "Six Six Six is just the number after Six Six Five."

There have been LOTS of name associations with 666.

They made quite a game of it during the Reformation, with people on each side declaring that Martin Luther's or Pope Leo X's names could be calculated to 666 and therefore they were the ANTI-CHRIST!!!

Of course what strikes a European reader is that the ame Americans most afraid of One World Government are those who find it almost literaly unthinkable that any part of the world should govern itsef without reference to their wishes.

All they need is for Buck or rayford or which ever manly man is the reporter to go take a lunch break in a nearby park, the conspicuously absent sound of children would add pointiencey and if you had Steve (of "Adam and Steve"?) talk about romania there, but accept that the conversation is ludicrous but steve is still insistant that romania is an intersting story, but does so in all sorts of conspiracy theory type ways. That way Buck going to romania would make it seem like there is some strange as yet unknown reason why rayford must be in romania, adds mystery and gives us a pointient glimpse in the aftermath of the rapture.

"It was quiet, too quiet. Buck's senses kept screaming at him about something being wrong, but he couldn't quite place it.

Then it struck him - they were gone, the sounds of play, of youthful innocence spent getting dirty in the sun's rays, all the children that usually congregated the park were not here, and may never be again.

For the second time that day Buck cried for the lost, huge heaving sobs that felt like his very soul was being ejected from his body along with his tears. He cried for a long time, and just as he was pulling himself together, a figure sat down beside him.

"Hi Ray." Steve, his coworker, said.

"huh? uh...Hi Steve." Buck replied gruffly, trying to pretend that he hadn't been crying.

"So, did you hear about that election in romania?" Steve said, just as Buck looked as his coworker's eyes, which were red and puffy as though he too had been crying not too long ago.

"What? What does that matter now steve!?" Buck replied, anger tinting his voice.

"Heard there was a big shake up there." Steve stated, getting out his lunch clamly "I think you'd better check it out."

And then they can chuck in all the conspiracy theory stuff, a breif pause for the gone isn't anethema to the gorramn story.

Since LB was written in 1992-1993, apparently L&J had already completely forgotten the dramatic Romanian Revolution of 1989 just 2 years before, which ended with Ceausescu getting shot in front of a wall (very vivid image, that).
On Christmas Day, too. How could L&J pass up on that plot detail?

Ah. sorry. Didn't think of that. My view of that particular group of books is a bit tainted by Leviticus and its use or misuse by generations of people whose view of the world I don't admire.

666: The Number of the Beast
0.666 Number of the Millibeast
0.00150150... Reciprocal of the Beast
25.8069758... Square Root of the Beast
443556 Square of the Beast
1010011010 Binary Number of the Beast
1232 Octal of the Beast
29A Hexidecimal of the Beast

$666/hr Billing Rate of the Beast's Lawyer
$665.95 Retail Price of the Beast
$699.25 Price of the Beast plus 5% State Sales Tax
$769.95 Price of the Beast with accessories and replacement soul
$656.66 Wal-Mart Price of the Beast
$646.66 Next week's Wal-Mart Price of the Beast
$55.50 Monthly Payments for Beast, in 12 easy installments...

And what will grumpy old men who used to yell at kids to stay out of their yards do now? (Assuming that bitter old age is not pleasing to God, of course.) Will they form support groups where they can reminisce about the missing kids, and how much damage the kids did to their lawns and flower beds?

You know, if this little scene doesn't prove that Buck and Rayford ar Mary Sues, then nothing can. There simple explanation for having Buck assigned ot a story like Romania after the disappearanc of 1/3rd of the world is that Buck is a rotten reporter and they want him out of the way. Simple, believable, and it makes complete sense within the context of the world they have created.

But they cannot do that because, for some reason, Buck must be The Greatest Investigative Reporter in the World. In other words, he's a Mary Sue. These things aren't just bad theology and rapture porn -- they are Biblical fan fic.

It's a little as if all you knew of the New Testament was through seeing Mel Gibson's (reputedly) gory movie, and you started saying things like "Wow, that Tarantino, he was really New Testament, wasn't he? Did you ever see Reservoir Dogs?".

Actually, that sounds pretty cool. I might start using that.

BTW, the DCLXVI comment above was me; posted in haste.

Another thought just occurred to me. As Ray points out, above:

Seems like such an event would be catastrophic for the pregnant woman. Either the disappearing fetus leaves a void, causing an embolus in the uterus, or it creates a sudden vacuum, which would be just as deadly. And we already know that the engineer of these disappearances is unconcerned with collateral damage, given the plane crashes & such.

(Granted, I'm the kind who believes that the bodiless piles of clothing seen in Rapture scenarios ought to be filled with the steaming contents of the departed ones' digestive tracts.)

Er, Ray points out above, "Apparently, babies in the womb disappeared overnight, along with all kids under 12...." Does that help?

It's ironic that the very people who are so against reading metaphor into the "Old" Testament can't make any sense of the "New" without them. Revelation never belonged in the approved canon. Yet one cannot begin to grasp United States foreign policy in the Bush II Era without knowing something of the book & the screwy theologies it inspired in this nation's knucklehead protestant right. Oh well, Christianity has throughout its history suffered occasional epidemics of mass stupidity.

"Apparently, however, not a single head of state was among the disappeared, so aside from Romania, every other administration remains intact. This means that every head of state is both a heathen . . ."

So how do the fundagelicals explain their rabid loyalty to the current administration? If God put the administration in power, then they all should have been raptured. But if they aren't gone, then that must mean that, in the LB universe, Democrats are in charge. If the rapture is to take place, all of the prophetic moons of Jupiter must be properly aligned. So then it becomes obvious that for the rapture to occur (to take all the "good" Christians home, doncha know), all of the conservative fundagelical christians ought to be voting Democrat in every upcoming election.

You can't get raptured if you vote Republican.

Obligatory reference to 668, the Neighbour of the Beast.

::goes back to lurking::

It's fiction, not real.

Interesting argument, Rev Ref. I suppose if people believe LB is factual and want the rapture to occur, they should try to create a world as close to theLB description as possible. So, in addition to voting Democrat, they should be putting all their efforts into encouraging serious interest in a single world currency and making the UN the most powerful governing body in the world. (I'm not sure how they're going to go about lengthening Manhattan, but I suppose if faith can move mountains, it can move rivers too.)

some (okay, me) rather dislike hearing it used as shorthand for unrelenting and probably disproportionate punishment.

Me too. I know it's done without any ill intent, but it still makes me wince.

George Walker Bush = 664
But since he is original last name is german then it is:
George Walker Busche = 666

Anyone else notice that Steve Plank is another porn-star name?

George Walker Bush = 664
But since he is original last name is german then it is:
George Walker Busche = 666

George Walker Bush = 664
But since he is original last name is german then it is:
George Walker Busche = 666

Sorry I normally use Opera as my browser and it never completed the posting of my comments. So I resubmitted a couple of times.

So, in addition to voting Democrat, they should be putting all their efforts into encouraging serious interest in a single world currency and making the UN the most powerful governing body in the world.

But you're forgetting: per the mindset at work here, the good Christians are vastly outnumbered everywhere by us heathens, unbelievers, Unitarians, gays, and so on. They can rest assured, voting for BushCo. won't matter on a global scale because we are destined to bring our sinful lifestyles to the forefront and outvote 'em, thus bringing about the Rapture regardless. I'm sure many of these people had to have a lie-down after the election, as it is very hard to claim the "outnumbered" and "persecuted" cards and still have what amounts to a razor-thin electoral majority.

(I didn't say it made sense.)

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