L.B.: Cruel to be kind, pt. 1

Left Behind, pp. 367-377

Rayford was as earnest, honest and forthright with Hattie as he had ever been.

The authors don't mean this as tactful ambiguity ("I've never heard you sing better") -- they mean this. Rayford is intended in these pages to be a portrait of sincerity, honesty and candor. More than that, though, he is meant here to serve as a model of real, true Christian evangelism. The key to appreciating these pages is found near the end of this section:

Rayford felt much like Bruce Barnes had sounded the day they met. He was full of passion and persuasion, and he felt his prayers for courage and coherence were answered as he spoke.

Rayford, in other words, is divinely guided here to become the ideal evangelist. He has been transformed through prayer into a soul-savin' mofo with a spirit-led mojo. If readers want to know how to witness/evangelize/proselytize/lead-others-to-a-saving-knowledge-of-Jesus-Christ-as-their-own-personal-Lord-and-Savior, then these pages here are where LaHaye and Jenkins show them how to do it.

That makes this section of Left Behind strange and alien-seeming even for lifelong natives of the evangelical American subculture, because this is unlike any kind of evangelism even they have seen before. Rayford does not tell Hattie that "God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life." He doesn't walk her along the "Romans Road" or draw for her the "Bridge Illustration" or read to her from the kente cloth of the Wordless Book.

Rayford never even mentions Jesus. At all. His approach, instead, is to make Hattie squirm until she cries, and then to start in on the prophecy stuff:

They sat across from each other in overstuffed chairs in the corner of a large, noisy room where they could not be heard by anyone else.

"Hattie," he said, "I'm not here to argue with you or even to have a conversation. There are things I must tell you, and I want you just to listen.

"I don't get to say anything? Because there may be things I'll want you to know, too."

"Of course I'll let you tell me anything you want, but this first part, my part, I don't want to be a dialogue. "

So Rayford was as creepy, controlling and condescending with Hattie as he had ever been.

"I have to get some things off my chest, and I want you to get the whole picture before you respond, OK?"

She shrugged. "I don't see how I have a choice."

"You had a choice, Hattie. You didn't have to come."

"I didn't really want to come. I told you that and you left that guilt-trip message, begging me to meet you here."

Rayford was frustrated. "You see what I didn't want to get into?" he said.

This is what the authors mean by courage and passion. If it seems more like bullying and badgering to you, then you just don't appreciate what's at stake here. Rayford is fighting for Hattie's very soul. With eternity at stake, he can't afford to be polite and he doesn't have time for a conversation or a dialogue. The authors earnestly, honestly and forthrightly believe that this is how evangelism works. They're kind of like Amway reps, except that they believe you will die if you don't buy the soap and join the sales team.

To get a better sense of their perspective, here's Jerry Jenkins sharing his favorite analogy, one that he employs and alludes to repeatedly in the Left Behind series:

I've often said that if I had a neighbor who truly believed that the only way to heaven was by wearing a purple necklace, I might find this humorous or even repugnant, but I would be offended if he didn't at least tell me. Not telling me for fear of my negative response would prove he doesn't really care about me.

Apart from his reducing faith to merely "the way to heaven," that's not a terrible illustration of why evangelism is often a loving act. It can be, and should be, an invitation. If you're going to extend an invitation, however, you have to be willing to take No for an answer. Otherwise you're not making an invitation, you're making an offer they can't refuse.

In his purple necklace illustration, Jenkins wants to have it both ways. He wants others to understand that when he tells them about his magic Jesus necklace, it is a sincere ("earnest, honest and forthright") expression of his concern. It is evidence that he "really cares" about them. But if they find his evangelizing "humorous or repugnant," or merely unconvincing, then he wants to keep on telling about his necklace, over and over, because he's sure that anyone who really understands about the necklace will accept the truth of it and join him in wearing the necklace and hectoring others to do the same. Thus we have Rayford Steele here with Hattie, refusing to allow her to speak until he has finished explaining his weird prophecy-gospel.

Think of those sexual harrassment seminars they have at the office. Asking a co-worker out on a date is not sexual harassment. That's merely an invitation. But refusing to take No for an answer -- refusing to accept that your invitation has not been accepted -- that is harassment. In this chapter, Rayford the evangelist isn't just a harasser, he's a stalker -- calling her dozens of times a day, following her home and hanging out in the bushes outside her house. This behavior, L&J tell us, is evidence of his "passion" and "courage."

For Rayford Steele, even "apologizing" doesn't mean yielding an ounce of control:

"How can I apologize when all you want to do is argue about why you're here?"

"You want to apologize, Rayford? I would never stand in the way of that."

She was being sarcastic, but he had gotten her attention. "Yes, I do. Now will you let me?" She nodded. "Because I want to get through this, to set the record straight, to take all the blame I should ..."

Notice the restriction, the limit, the way this apology is prefaced as also an accusation. This isn't an apology, it's a legal settlement. The party of the first part herein concedes responsibility and expresses remorse for the following aspects of the dispute, such expression, henceforth to be referred to as "The Apology," shall be construed as applying exclusively to these aspects of said dispute and may not be interpreted as an acknowledgment of guilt, responsibility, liability, regret, remorse or shame with regard to any aspect of said dispute not specifically enumerated herein. ...

"... to take all the blame I should, and then I want to tell you what I hinted at on the phone the other night."

"About how you've discovered what the vanishings are all about."

He held up a hand. "Don't get ahead of me."

"Sorry," she said, putting her hand over her mouth. "But why don't you just let me hear it when you answer Buck's questions tonight?" Rayford rolled his eyes. "I was just wondering," she said. "Jut a suggestion so you don't have to repeat yourself."

That was Hattie, there, who uttered the word "Sorry." Rayford is the one rolling his eyes and holding up a hand to silence her. (I'm starting to think this scene would play better if the parts of Rayford and Hattie were played, respectively, by Dianne Wiest and John Cusack.)

"I don't mind telling it over and over," Rayford tells her, "and if my guess is right, you won't mind hearing it again and again."

Here's the thing I don't get about this scene -- or, for that matter, about all of the subsequent stalker-evangelist scenes in this book and the rest of the series: It's the End Times. Rayford has direct access to the divine decoder ring that tells him exactly what is going to happen over the next seven years. He doesn't need persuasion, he's got proof. He can demonstrate that what he is telling people is true.

All he needs to do is tell people about the next few items on the End Times Checklist and let them see for themselves soon enough: "... Then after that, there will be a ginormous earthquake, the sun will turn black, the moon will turn red and every mountain and island will be removed from its place. Here's my card, you call me after the sun turns black and we'll talk some more." That seems like a potentially more fruitful approach than just cornering people and making them shut up until you've made your pitch "over and over ... again and again."

I feel bad breaking off here and leaving poor Hattie stuck on mute for another week, but Rayford's lecture continues for several more pages, some of which is so skin-crawlingly awful that I can only take it in small doses.

Comments

[cjmr]

Yep, competing stanzas at twenty paces.

[Jeff]

And a coworker in a somewhat-managerial position with relation to Hattie?

That's part of what led to my response. A sexual harrassment suit is likely. His inability to take "No" for answer -- even on the second asking -- would have wound him up in BIG trouble.

[Jeff]

Yep, competing stanzas at twenty paces.

Can we have Eks set up another poll on Right Behind?

[bulbul]

"Those two clowns offering literary criticism is like Zastava Automobili (Makers of that paragon of automotive engineering, the Yugo) offering Toyota or BMW quality control advice"
As the resident ambassador of all Central and European peoples, I object to this unprecedented act of defamation. While certainly not the pinnacle of engineering excellence, Zastava Automobili and/or their product have done nothing - NOTHING - to deserve the insult of being compared to LaHaye and Jenkins.

[PurpleGirl]

Haven't read the whole posting yet, but Fred, you are one brave man to read this stuff, digest, analyze and critic it. We offer you our humblest thanks. (And the entertainment value ain't bad either.)

[Jon]

@edo: Yay, a Kalevala reference!

[Drak Pope]

You're right.

A better analogy would be Stalin and Hitler Mao starting a course on how to treat your fellow human being with compassion and mercy.

[Tim Lehnerer]

I once made a mix tape that was 26 versions of the same song by different bands. I may be more obsessive than the Antichrist.

[mcc]

I once made a mix tape that was 26 versions of the same song by different bands.

Which song was it?

[Dahne]

I like how that very long hyphenation got cut off by my browser:

lead-others-to-a-saving-knowledge-of-Jesus-Christ-as-their-own-personal-L

If Jesus was a brilliant, eccentric detective who never wore shoes and ate green tea ice cream a lot, I would join up like that.

[jamoche]

I told you that and you left that guilt-trip message, begging me to meet you here

The one thing guaranteed to get me to dump someone fast is a guilt-trip message. From a co-worker? Not just dumping, but complaints to HR.

Ray rolls his freakin eyes at her? do manly men roll their eyes? Ya know who rolls their eyes when someone says something reasonable that they think is stoopid? twelve year old girls.

And Princess Diana.

My mom used to get on me for doing that, and I am so glad, because when they did the retrospective of Princess Di just after she died, seemed like she was *always* doing that - and yes, it does look very childish.

Figures from the religious right, particularly the authors of the "Left Behind" series, are out campaigning against your film. What's your reaction to that?

Mine would be "bring it on". Protests like that bring the curious into the seats almost as well as advertising does.

[Jon]

I actually just went to see The Golden Compass with a friend today. Said friend is a Mormon whose wife refuses to see it because of the apparent pro-atheism viewpoint of the books. I can't really comment on that aspect of the books, as I'd never even heard of them before seeing the first trailers for the movie.
This wasn't any sort of major dispute between them; she was standing on principle, but didn't feel it was a big enough issue to fight about, and for his part, all he cared about was that it's a fantasy movie with what looked to be some cool effects.
(For the record, it wasn't a great movie, but I liked it more than I expected to.)
Anyway, I don't really have any canny insights or anything, I just thought it was worth mentioning, given that the movie and Mormonism have been topics for discussion here.

[mcc]

Mine would be "bring it on". Protests like that bring the curious into the seats almost as well as advertising does.

From reading the reviews, it sounds like the off-screen outrage is practically all the film has going for it. All the reviewers I've seen seem to be reacting as if they went in expecting something deep and provocative and were disappointed when they instead got a featherweight over-CGIed amusement park ride.

[libby]

which song?

[jamoche]

they went in expecting something deep and provocative and were disappointed when they instead got a featherweight over-CGIed amusement park ride.

With Daniel Craig.

So I'm shallow :)

(Actually, that's good to know - it's pretty much what I'm expecting so I won't be disappointed; I only got partway through the first book and wasn't exactly sold on the "it's deep and provocative" to begin with).

[Spalanzani]

Dahne: "If Jesus was a brilliant, eccentric detective who never wore shoes and ate green tea ice cream a lot, I would join up like that."

Not only that, but Jesus is also really the 2nd and 3rd best personal saviors in the world as well, under the aliases of Buddha and Muhammad.

[Jon]

Apart from the sort of standard stuff for fundies to get upset about - magic, witches, "familiar spirits," etc. - there wasn't any real obvious religion-bashing in the movie, which, from what I've heard/seen online, is something that the author is upset about, and which also poses a problem for any sequels, as it means that an integral part of the story is simply missing. The analogy that comes to my mind based on what I've heard/read, is that making sequels without the anti-religious content would be like trying to make a Left Behind movie without any reference to The Rapture. Though, again, I haven't read the books, so I'm not sure how accurate that view of things is, as I'm just going off of what I've heard.

[Tim Lehnerer]

I once made a mix tape that was 26 versions of the same song by different bands.

Which song was it?

"Telstar", by the Tornados, Joe Goldmark, Video Aventures, Ronnie Montrose, the Hawaiians, Technostar, Toulouse Engelhart, Huevos Rancheros, The BBC Concert Orchestra, the Models, Velvet Fogg, Jackie Mittoo, the Portsmouth Sinfonia, the Compulsive Gamblers, the Tornados (live in concert), the Ska-Dows, Thurston Moore & Don Englehart, Bobby Rydell (with lyrics, which is really too bad), Evan Johns & His H-Bombs, Tornadoes '74, the Ukrainians, the Tolley Town Orchestra, Camilio Felgen (with lyrics in German), Ricky King, the Champs and the Lively Ones.

[animus]

In his purple necklace illustration, Jenkins wants to have it both ways. He wants others to understand that when he tells them about his magic Jesus necklace, it is a sincere ("earnest, honest and forthright") expression of his concern.

Why do I keep reading "purple necklace" as "pearl necklace"?

[ohiolibrarian]

JoXn: I have to admit that when God protects Israel from an all-out no-holds-barred nukular attack by Russia, I won't even need to wait for the Rapture...

I wouldn't necessarily believe that the PMDs were right, but I would definitely believe that a very powerful entity was going to dramatic lengths to make it look like the PMDs were right, and my best option (as a not-at-all-powerful entity) might be to play along and keep my eyes and ears open.

Why would most people connect such an event with PMDs? I would think that most people would be converting to Judaism, if anything. Especially since most of the PMDs are *poof* and can't make the "appropriate interpretations". It's not like the Bible ever actually mentions Russia or anything.

[Jeff]

A lot of of blogs are getting in a twist over H.R.3791 and S.519: The Securing Adolescents From Exploitation-Online Act. This was passed out of the House to the Senate Judiciary Committee. The vote was a procedural one.

They didn't pass the Act per-se. The Senate bill was passed back to committee where it appears to be languishing.

It doesn't help that there at least 3 SAFE Acts.

[Jesurgislac]

Yayyyy! LB Friday!

This time it hurt to read. :-(

(So The Golden Compass is good? Excellent! I'm looking forward to going after opening weekend crush is over.)

[Ken]

I feel bad breaking off here and leaving poor Hattie stuck on mute for another week, but Rayford's lecture continues for several more pages, some of which is so skin-crawlingly awful that I can only take it in small doses. -- Slack

Then don't post it page-by-page. Do a summary.

We've seen what you can take in previous postings. If you can't take what's about to come up, it really must be brain-bleach awful -- more awful than the awful writing and theology you HAVE posted.

And we're coming to the end of Volume 1 (only 10% left, assuming 400 pages/volume). If LH&J follow the standard Christian Fiction tropes, now comes the Plan of Salvation Presentation, the Altar-Call. Plus the Christian Apocalyptic Fiction trope of the Talking-Head Break, where the character breaks the fourth wall and explains directly to the reader/audience how what we have just read/seen fulfills which End Time Prophecy.

One of the things about Conventional Christian Fiction that drives me up the wall is the interrupts for talking-head Propaganda Preaching. In this department, there's very little difference between Christians and Phil Pullman or 9/11 Truthers or Global Warming Activists or PETAns or Ross Perotistas or Stalin-era Pravda or what comes out of North Korea or Iran today. Storytelling is only tolerated as long as it Preaches The Correct Ideology -- Over and Over and Over and Over and Over...

If Christ were half of what Jesus Fanboys claim, He wouldn't need to stoop to such cheap tricks. LH&J and their ilk have a puny God, a puny Christ, and a Punyverse.

Cannot comment any more. Leaving for office Xmas party.

[Mau de Katt]

Pullman is an atheist? I thought he believed in some version of Gnosticism. The Dark Materials trilogy reads very Gnostic-y....

That was Hattie, there, who uttered the word "Sorry."

Because she's gonna be the Antichrist's Ho! She's resisting the message of salvation!! No matter how creepy and stalkery and misogynistic Rayford is being, she deserves it for being, you know, a woman and sexual and all that!!! She needs to be thoroughly used and shamed and taught her proper place before anyone feels any sympathy for her or anything.

Or so LaJenkins seem to think.

[Craig]

Rayford's lecture continues for several more pages, some of which is so skin-crawlingly awful that I can only take it in small doses.

Does it involve Ray Ray shouting "call me Daddy!" and huffing a gas bottle?

[sabreuse]

Rayford was as earnest, honest and forthright with Hattie as he had ever been.

The sad thing is, I don't doubt it at all. When you start from, well, Rayford, "talk to the hand" is a small (okay, really very small) step forward in communication.

[Bugmaster]

Is The Golden Compass actually any good ? I liked the first book a lot (was ambivalent about the second, wanted to slap the author right at the start of the third), but rottentomatoes gave the movie the "omg suxx0rz" rating, and they're usually reliable, so I don't know if I want to waste time/money/bandwidth on it...

[Mau de Katt]

In his purple necklace illustration, Jenkins wants to have it both ways.

That's pretty typical of the whole premise of the series. How I've heard/read PMD post-Rapture Christianity explained is that the reason for the Rapture in the first place is that it highlights the departure of the Holy Spirit from the world. The theory goes that the only force keeping Satan And His Evil Minions in check is the Holy Spirit, so the Spirit's departure is necessary for the Full Force Of Evil (i.e. the Antichrist etc) to be unleashed. And since RTCs are indwelt by the Holy Spirit, they have to be departed too. And thus post-Rapture Christians will have to muddle through the Tribulation without benefit of the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit. (So Get Saved Now, before this Special Offer Expires!) That seems to be a pretty standard theme of the PMD screeds I've read over the past... what... three? decades.

But in the second book, Tribulation Force, we see that LaJenkins do not follow this -- the post-Rapture believers clearly have the presence of the Holy Spirit, not only indwelling but Manifestly Manifesting even, almost to a visible and tangible degree.

Cake == having+eating.

[Craig]

Is The Golden Compass actually any good ?

From collating some (generally accurate) reviews, I get the impression that it's more an attempt to ride the coattails of LotR/Narnia than a legitimate effort, and that's beside any neutering of the content.

I haven't actually seen it, though, so grain of salt and all.

[car]

Thing is, they really could have made one of their own points with Hattie, if they had done it differently. IIRC, Hattie is painted very simply from now on, as someone who heard and rejected the message of God and is therefore responsible for her own downfall, blah blah blah.
How much more of a point they could have made if they had done this very scene in a different way. One of the tenets of evangelism is that you must get people to hear the message, and that you are partly responsible if they do not ever get to hear it. Here's a rewrite:
*****************
"I didn't really want to come. I told you that and you left that guilt-trip message, begging me to meet you here."

Rayford was frustrated. "You see what I didn't want to get into?" he said.

Hattie snapped. "What you didn't want to get into? What YOU didn't want to get into?" Her eyes blazed. "I've been following you around for years. You, leading me on just enough to keep me interested. Every time I tried to break free, to treat you as just a co-worker, you would start sweet-talking me, touching me as you walked by, making sure I would notice you. Then the end of the world happened, and you abandoned me. I tried to reach out to you, and you knocked me back every time."

Rayford tried to interrupt:"I was upset about my family..."

"SHIT about your family, Rayford! Everyone lost family! I lost family! The absolute least you could do was treat me like a human being, and you cut me loose like a lost puppy you kicked to the curb! And now you reel me back in again, just like always, because suddenly YOU have something important you need to share. Well, guess what, Rayford. You've run out of chances with me. You cashed in your last remaining bit of goodwill a long time ago. You ignored me every time I tried to talk to you, tried to listen to you, and I finally got the message. No, Rayford Steele. I won't listen to you. You had your chance, several times over. I won't let you suck me in again just to spit me out." Hattie stormed out of the room.

Rayford tried several times that week to call her, but every time he said hello, she hung up.
******************

This way, he can spend the rest of the series in agony every time he hears something of Hattie and Nicky, because he realizes that it was his attitude that kept her from hearing the gospel. He can take the lesson from it to treat people nicely because they won't listen to you otherwise. It could be an actual learning experience for him.
But, no. It's just Hattie being a stubborn mean atheist.

[Mark Z.]

What Jenkins' purple necklace illustration makes clear is he doesn't give a shit about Jesus. Jesus is just the meaningless, arbitrary purple necklace.* For Jenkins, Christianity is not about believing in anything true, or obedience out of love and trust. It's a plea bargain with God. God can kill you and send you to hell, so if he says "wear a purple necklace", you wear the goddamn purple necklace. No wonder Jenkins' vision of evangelism sucks. He has nothing to offer. There's no "Everything will live where the river flows," no "Proclaim freedom to the captives and sight to the blind," not even a "Take up your cross and follow." Only the chance to cower in fear.

If the way to heaven is to wear a purple necklace, then heaven isn't a place of peace or joy or friendship. It's a place of purple necklaces, and to hell with it.

* My fellow Babylon 5 fans will recall the Drazi method of choosing leaders.

[Geds]

My fellow Babylon 5 fans will recall the Drazi method of choosing leaders

"Now you can start by helping me understand the precise nature of the conflict between the two sides."

"Green."

"Purple."

"No, no, I understand that there are two factions but what is your point of conflict? Where do you disagree with each other?"

"Purple!"

"Green!"

[McJulie]

I've often said that if I had a neighbor who truly believed that the only way to heaven was by wearing a purple necklace, I might find this humorous or even repugnant, but I would be offended if he didn't at least tell me. Not telling me for fear of my negative response would prove he doesn't really care about me.

You know, the problem with this statement, is I simply don't believe him.

It doesn't fit with his actions in other analogous areas. I believe that when confronted with a real-life version of the purple necklace theory he would actively seek to prevent schoolchildren from being exposed to the purple necklace theory. He would complain about the rise of the purple necklace theory in popular culture. He might even write an entire series of terrible novels specifically attacking the purple necklace theory.

[Cowboy Diva]

the Blues and the Greens

as referenced by The Tomorrow People, that bbc kids show I watched on nickelodeon when I was much much younger.

[Jake]

Animus: Why do I keep reading "purple necklace" as "pearl necklace"?

Because you're a perv? Just sayin'...

Mau de Katt: *Snipped stuff about how the Holy Spirit leaves earth at the Rapture.*
And thus post-Rapture Christians will have to muddle through the Tribulation without benefit of the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit.

Wait, that doesn't make any sense! I thought these folks (largely Calvinists, yes?) believed that the only way to get saved was if the Holy Spirit did an abracadabra and *poofed* belief into your heart. If the Holy Spirit is gone from Earth, how can there be post-Rapture conversion? To quote River Tam, "It doesn't. Make. Sense."

Don't know why, but I feel the need to share that the song that just came up on my iTunes is The Brews by NOFX

[libby]

their bible's more broken than most.

[Jon]

(So The Golden Compass is good? Excellent! I'm looking forward to going after opening weekend crush is over.)

Good? Well, it depends on what you want to get out of it, I guess. Having never read the books, I had no real expectations apart from seeing a fairly standard fantasy movie.
I can't comment on how faithful it remained to the source material, but I will say that there were places in which it definitely seemed as though something (though I have no idea what) was missing, giving the general feeling of being a bit rushed.
I thought there were some very good bits of characterization and I liked the fact that, while young, the protagonist wasn't dense in the way that, say, Harry Potter usually is, and was actually pretty clever. (My principal objection to Harry's denseness is that it exists solely for narrative purposes - a common problem in a lot of works of fiction - and as a result feels artificial, and can be quite maddening.)
I also liked that the protagonist was a girl, and was pleasantly surprised that, in a Hollywood movie, she was presented as being competent and clever and largely fearless.
Also, I don't have the same kind of objections to CGI action that a lot of people seem to have, so that probably skews my perception of the movie as well. I actually like (well-done) CGI. Your mileage, will, of course, vary
On the down side, there were a lot of scenes that were awkwardly expository.
And while there is a lot of CGI action it seems to be sort of lacking the kind of scope of LOTR or Narnia, which may or may not be a bad thing, depending on how you feel about that sort of thing.
So that's my somewhat ambiguous view of the movie. I guess the best I can say is that, because I didn't have high expectations I didn't have to worry about being disappointed, but it does have some elements that were genuinely entertaining, interesting, and surprising.

[Drak Pope]

My mom used to get on me for doing that, and I am so glad, because when they did the retrospective of Princess Di just after she died, seemed like she was *always* doing that - and yes, it does look very childish.

I believe the retrospective also mentioned that she prayed with the sick and that her bodily fluids could cure cancer. I think we can forgive a bit of eye-rolling after that.

[sievetronix]

"Okay, seriously, show of hands. Who would stick around for the conversation after an exchange like this?"

Depends on who is paying for dinner, The only thing that is washing that bullshit down is a very expensive dinner and lots of liquor.

[Vermic]

"I have to get some things off my chest, and I want you to get the whole picture before you respond, OK?"
She shrugged. "I don't see how I have a choice."

I may take some heat for this opinion, but if I were in Hattie's place, I don't think it would kill me to bite my tongue and keep quiet for five minutes until the creepy rude guy finished saying whatever he needed to say. Don't get me wrong, Rayford's pushy behavior in this scene is inexcusable. All the more reason, though, to let this jerk get his little speech off his chest once and for all, and not interrupt him every other sentence, because that's only going to draw things out longer. Of course, simply walking away is acceptable too (parting taser zap optional). But for heaven's sake, Hattie, if you've made up your mind to stay and listen to this man, then listen to him. If you have to speak up every time Rayford says something rude, you'll be there till Christmas.

[Bugmaster]

For what it's worth, in the book, the girl isn't fearless per se; she is afraid quite often, but she knows that she must go on, despite her fear. I find that kind of characterization more appealing than the typical "yar ! hero smash !" attitude of most fantasy protagonists.

[Gabriel]

To tell the truth, the Rayford/Hattie exchanges quoted in this installment creep me out more than the Buck/Chloe pedo-fantasy comments from last installment.

Perhaps it's because the pedo-comments are intended as humor, while here we are faced with something which I'm assuming should be taken in all seriousness. Rayford is basically saying "Shut up you stupid bitch. A MAN is talking, and you must listen."

"He felt his prayers for courage and coherence were answered as he spoke."

Rayford is speaking as God. And God says to shut the fuck up, because nothing you have to contribute is at all important.

Nice worldview there.

Not that it's surprising. This is the same worldview of the rest of the book.

"I don't want [to be] a dialogue. "

Remove the bracketed words for what is actually being said.

Probably even more telling is the setting of the scene: "in the corner of a large, noisy room where they could not be heard by anyone else. "

This is not sharing of important soul saving news. This is a formal reprimand. This is a dressing down of a subordinate. The boss has closed the door and it's time to berate the employee. "You aren't being a team player Hattie. It's time to submerge that individuality and live by the company line."

[SKJAM!]

The Golden Compass movie deals with the big twist in the final chapter of the first book--by not having it. The story simply stops a chapter or so earlier.

I can certainly understand why, though.

[Drak Pope]

If you have to speak up every time Rayford says something rude, you'll be there till Christmas.

not to mention, the fricking rapture just took place. If I were her, I would be too freaked out to antagonize any of my friends who thought they knew what had happened unless I was absolutely sure that he was wrong. And if she doesn't have many friends or close family members near, she might pull even freaks like Rayford and Chloe closer to her out of the raw human need not to be alone in times of crisis. That might even explain why she goes for the Nicolae Carpathia, who seriously rivals Rayford for sheer skin-crawling loathesomeness especially later on in the series.

[MerrySue]

Then she stepped over his charred remains and into a new book, a different book, where she could find a man who would talk to her without condescension.

*Dies laughing. Husband applies CPR.*

[Jon]

For what it's worth, in the book, the girl isn't fearless per se; she is afraid quite often, but she knows that she must go on, despite her fear.
"Fearless" was a poor word choice on my part; in the movie she is presented in much the fashion that you describe, and, in fact, there is some discussion about the fact that she is afraid but is facing up to her fears and pushing on.
I was just trying to say that she wasn't presented as panicky and hysterical, not that she was sort of brainlessly fearless and ready to jump headlong into trouble without a thought.

[Jake]

Gabriel: Rayford is basically saying "Shut up you stupid bitch. A MAN is talking, and you must listen."

This is the impression I get as well. And it's persistent throught the first two books, iirc (I haven't read past that, but I'm sure it doesn't go away in book three). Mostly reading this book was an exercise in hilarity. I would read it aloud to my SO and dad and we'd laugh and laugh, but things like this just made me want to throw it across the room. *shudder* What's terrifying is that you just *know* that this is how L&J behave irl. They think that Rayford's behaviour here constitutes bending over backward to be polite, and that *he's* entitled to be annoyed with *Hattie*. If either of these authors had to spend ten minutes with a feminist woman who wouldn't be shot down, they'd probably resort to violence. That a woman could expect or deserve to be treated like a human being is just beyond their ability to conceive.

"Wait, that doesn't make any sense! I thought these folks (largely Calvinists, yes?) believed that the only way to get saved was if the Holy Spirit did an abracadabra and *poofed* belief into your heart. If the Holy Spirit is gone from Earth, how can there be post-Rapture conversion? To quote River Tam, "It doesn't. Make. Sense.""

I have talked with Christians who felt the Left Behind books were too lenient because they allowed the possibility of post-Rapture conversion.

[Jake]

I have talked with Christians who felt the Left Behind books were too lenient because they allowed the possibility of post-Rapture conversion.

Oh the infighting, it is to laugh. And then to stop laughing when you realise that no matter what side comes out on top, you're still getting your ass nailed to the wall.

[stinger]

slacktivist: 'reducing faith to merely "the way to heaven,"'

Because for LaJenkins and their ilk, religion is not about How to Live, it's about How to Avoid Dying.

Good luck with that.