This is country music

Unfortunately, due to copyright restrictions, readers in some areas of the world may not be able to see all the videos linked to in this article. Watching the videos is not necessary to appreciate and enjoy the piece.

I used to love country music. I still do, really. Martina McBride's "Independence Day" is one of my all-time favorite songs, and it showcases one of the reasons country music as a whole is so successful: the genre tackles hard subjects. In the case of "Independence Day", it's domestic violence.

Well word gets around in a small, small town / they said he was a dangerous man / but Mama was proud and she stood her ground / she knew she was on the losing end / some folks whispered, some folks talked / but everybody looked the other way / and when time ran out there was no one about / on Independence Day.

It's heartbreaking. Another example of why country music is so good is Rascal Flatts's "Skin (Sarabeth)".

Sarabeth is scared to death / 'cause the doctor just told her the news / "Between the red cells and white, something's not right / but we're gonna take care of you."

Sarabeth has leukemia, another tough subject that country music tackles and most folks prefer to avoid.

Well you're not supposed to say the word 'cancer' / in a song [...] yeah, that might be true / but this is country music / and we do.

That's from Brad Paisley's "This is Country Music".

Do you like to drink a cold one on the weekends / and get a little loud? / Do you wanna say 'I'm sorry' or 'I love you' / but you don't know how? / And do you wish somebody had the nerve / to tell that stupid boss of yours to shove it / next time he yells at you? / Well, this is country music / and we do.

That's the good side of country music.

The bad side? Look at the lyrics I omitted from "This is Country Music".

And telling folks that Jesus is the answer / can rub 'em wrong.

Look at Trace Adkins's "Songs About Me", also a meta about country music.

It's songs about me / and who I am / songs about loving and living / and good-hearted women / and family and God / yeah they're all just songs about me.

There is no sense in either of these songs, or in any country song about religion that I can think of, that Christianity might not be the One True Way. More than that, there's barely acknowledgment that there are people who are not Christian in this world.

This is real, this is your life in a song

Brad Paisley sings, with no clue that some of his listeners might be among those who are rubbed wrong by being told that Jesus is the answer.

Well if there's anyone that still has pride / in the memory of those that died / defending the old red white and blue,

Paisley continues,

this is country music, and we do.

Country music tends to fetishize soldiers and war.

"Yeah your uncle and I made quite a pair / flying F-15s through hostile air / he went down but they missed me by a hair." / He'd always stop right there and say / "That's something to be proud of / that's a life you can hang your hat on."

Montgomery Gentry, "Something To Be Proud Of". As an Air Force brat, I can't say service to one's country is not something to be proud of, but at the same time, I cannot accept the implication that killing and dying are things to be proud of.

In the same song, Montgomery Gentry says

No need to make a million, just be thankful to be working.

The ways in which this line is wrong I leave as an exercise for the reader.

Going back to Trace Adkins, we have "Honky Tonk Badonkadonk". "All right, boys, this is her favorite song [...] so if we play it good and loud she might get up and dance again" leading into

Ole TW's girlfriend done slapped him outta his chair / poor ole boy, it ain't his fault it's so hard not to stare / at that honky tonk badonkadonk

and

Lord have mercy how'd she even get them britches on.

The entire song is an ode to the male gaze, in particular at an attractive female ass, with no conception whatsoever of the idea that maybe she doesn't want a crowd of strange men leering at her, or that maybe it's possible for a man not to leer at a pretty woman. The music video is worse.

The music video improves the song in the case of Carrie Underwood's "All-American Girl". The song is about gender roles: fishing and football are for boys, cheerleader is for girls. Watching the video tells us that 'soldier' is an occupation only available to boys.

When the nurse came in with a little pink blanket / all those big dreams changed.

Again drawing from the video, girls can be nurses, flight attendants, Miss America, waitresses, teachers, cooks, fashion designers, dancers. Stereotypical female jobs, all. Girls can also be police officers and firefighters and chemists and welders, though in our first glimpse of welder!Carrie, she doesn't exactly look experienced using the equipment. The sight of a woman at a podium with the presidential seal helps improve the song as well, but not enough, considering that glass ceiling remains firmly in place. (Here I take a moment to raise a glass in memory of Geraldine Ferraro.)

Country music is a constellation of fail. Carrie Underwood's "Some Hearts" used to be one of my favorite songs until I figured out that when she sings

I wake up feeling like my life's worth living / can't recall when I last felt that way / guess it must be all this love you're giving,

she's talking about magical healing sex lifting depression.

Blake Shelton's "Who Are You When I'm Not Looking" is all about how the singer thinks he's entitled to know his girlfriend's secrets, just because she's his girlfriend.

Tim Mc Graw's "Down on the Farm"—Farmer Johnson's daughter's just pulled up in a Jeep / man he knows how to grow 'em if you know what I mean.

I leave the analysis of Kenny Chesney's "Everybody Wants to Go to Heaven" to the people with a personal stake in explaining why it is bad and wrong to believe that heaven is less fun than earth and to believe that putting money in the church plate pays for the sins committed earlier that weekend; the title of the song alone brings us back to the unrelenting Christian-centrism of country music.

Despite all this, I still love country music. I wish someone would tell me why.

-- MercuryBlue ____________________________________________________________________________

 

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Comments

[kisekileia]

First?

"Independence Day" is my favourite country song, and has been for years. I'm not a huge fan of the genre in general, but I've heard a lot of '90s country because my parents listened to it then, and I like "Independence Day". I was happy when I heard that Martina McBride has confirmed that the mother does NOT die in the song--it's kind of ambiguous from the lyrics, but knowing that the mother ends up OK makes the song happier for me.

[MercuryBlue]

'Placeholder title'? Uh, mods?

Wait, the mother didn't die? I never knew that.

Edited by the Slackmods: MercuryBlue noticed a mistake in the permalink -- which we have attempted to fix.

[Raj]

Of course Sean Hannity just has to use an out-of-context snippet of "Independence Day" as the opening theme of his show. I don't suppose he has ever considered the irony of the lyrics, "Let the right be wrong".

[kisekileia]

I just did some research to confirm, and apparently Martina McBride and the songwriter (Gretchen Peters) have different opinions on whether the mother dies. Martina says she doesn't. See here, about halfway down the page.

[MadGastronomer, who popped back up after a busy weekend to WTF misogyny and 'splaining]

Honkytonk Badonkadonk is a terrible song, but I have to admit I love this ASL interpretation of it by Keith Wann. Wann is a CODA -- a hearing Child of Deaf Adults -- an ASL comedian (his shirt quotes one of his routines), and part of the Music for All movement that interprets popular music for the Deaf (something which has been very rare).

More ASL music video recommendations: The New Shit (which includes an explanation of Music For All), Re: Your Brains, First of May, Make Me Stay, and one non-music, The Very Hungry Caterpillar.

Um. I didn't mean to go that far off topic so soon. Sorry. But it's cool! And I want to share it!

But yeah, I still like a lot of country music, too. I grew up on it, and while most of what I like is older -- Johnny Cash, Hank Williams Sr & Jr, Willie Nelson, Alabama, etc, I do like some more recent stuff as well, although I haven't kept up with it for a decade or more.

I like it because I find much of it to be intensely personal and relateable, plus I just like the sound. It's a very people sort of sound.

[Jason]

I would like some advice from my fellow cat people.

I had a quite beloved cat pass away about 4 years ago of a rather sudden illness. I still don't know exactly what was wrong with him. He just got reallys ick very quickly without warning.

I got another cat a couple of months later who is the cat I currently have now. Because of what happened I am rather paranoid about anything this one does out of the ordinary.

He has a loose joint in one of his legs that isn't a reason for concern but occasionally causes him pain. My vet told me that it is nothing to worry about as long as it pops back in it when it pops out on occasion. He told me this after looking at his leg for about 30 seconds. I took him to an emergency vet on a weekend when it was bothering him before I knew what the issue was. The emergency vet hosed me out of 600 bucks and was wanting to hose me out of more saying that the leg problem was most likely a blood clot that may kill him. I will never do business with them again.

Tonight I noticed that he had missed the litter box and some of his poo was on the floor. This is also something he does every once in a while. He can be a slob sometimes. I would not be concerned except that while it was mostly solid some of it was a little runnier than normal when I cleaned it up. He seems to be eating and drinking and playing as normal and seems to feel ok. Am I over reacting and worrying about something I shouldn't worry about? I have already researched alternate emergency vets just in case, but I guess I just need someone to help me feel better, because I realize I'm probably making a mountain out of a molehill.

[Mr. Cales]

Country music's quite nice, actually. It has a different "feel". The overwhelming Jesusness of it doesn't detract from that.

[alienbooknose]

@MadGastronomer: thanks for the ASL music video links. I love that Re Your Brains (I have a crush on that guy from his videos because he looks exactly like an old college boyfriend no longer looks, if that makes any sense) and the others were good and new to me. :)

@Jason: your cat is probably fine. If he keeps having not-in-litterbox weird-poops, take him to the vet. In the meantime, don't worry. *hugs*

[Brin (not Meir)]

Seconding the thanks. I've only watched the Re: Your Brains one so far, since it's the song I've heard before. I don't even know ASL, but it's still cool.

[Ruby]

I think I mentioned this one awhile back...another "Atheists Suck" country song...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0l772kLwKj4&feature=related

Oddly, though, I don't hate the tune...I like some country music, esp. when I don't listen to the lyrics.

[P J Evans]

MG, thanks for those links! 'The Very Hungry Caterpillar' is funny.

[Laiima (same old Laima, but I'm standardizing to match w Patheos & Pandagon)]

I've been a fan of (some) country music since I lived in OKC for a few months 25 years ago, and my A.M. car radio played only country, gospel, or talk radio. When I lived in Indiana, I got into more of the modern stuff: Shania Twain, Dixie Chicks, Brad Paisley, Martina McBride, Leann Rimes, Faith Hill. I *love* Independence Day.

I don't like all the Jesus talk. But what bugs me worse is the (seemingly) constant assertion that "the music of real people is country", and "everyone's ancestors love our stuff". I think maybe that comes from their experience where, even if they are city/suburban people now, their parents lived in the country, and so did listen to country music. That's true of Mr. Laiima in fact, but it's not true of me. I have ancestors that lived in the country, but in Europe. When they came to America, they were city & suburban people. And none of them ever listened to country music. So I am in *no* sense "getting back to my roots" when I listen to country music.

This is a bit of a sore point for me because I'm happy that I'm a city person, and from Chicagoland. The ancestors I had that loved being farmers are the ones I'm *not* descended from. I don't yearn to be a farmer or a rancher. And I think I would hate living in a small town. I found Indianapolis stifling, and it's the 12th largest city in the US.

[Ruby]

Gotta love the ads that are coming up after some of our recent discussions:

FREE SHIPPING on Twilight gear!!!!

[Joel Johnson]

@MercuryBlue -

I have a similar relationship with various metal bands (well not just metal; but I'm really bad with musical genre categorization, and mostly it vaguely falls under some type of metal so... yeah! I'm just going with that). ><

I adore stuff like Painkiller by Judas Priest... unfortunately if you spend any serious time within the genre it's pretty heavily soaked in at-best-questionable-often-outright-offensive lyrics. (Thankfully Painkiller isn't one of those songs. Which is good. Judas Priest thankfully has less fail than most on that front.)

Somewhere Far Beyond - Blind Guardian

Lowman's Lyric - Metallica

For Whom the Bell Tolls Metallica

All Guns Blazing - Judas Priest

Electric Eye - Judas Priest

I specifically picked songs that I felt were generally free of most objectionable lyrics; sadly even some of my favorites have lines that make me grit my teeth (x_x) ~le sigh; still enjoy it for what it is though.

-----

And now for something completely different! (A couple songs I just plain old love >.> and both are rather significant to me in their own special ways.)

The Bard's Song - Blind Guardian (It may not make sense to anyone else, but for me, it's a song about being a storyteller... which is something I want to be. I write, I draw, both in the hopes of eventually telling stories and entertaining people. Maybe I'll never be good enough; but that song always makes me want to keep trying.)

Wayward Son - Kansas (Frankly I can't explain this one in adequate terms. It'd take me a dozen paragraphs to even start. Suffice to say in a lot of ways this is 'my song' and I'll leave it at that. d(>.<)b)

(o^.^)[c[|||] *Kirby pass out rootbeer floats.*

[Izzy]

I like a fair amount of country, minus the Jesus. And the true-love-at-sixteen. And the true-love-waits.

McBride is damn good, as is Mary Chapin Carpenter, who does a bunch of stuff that's more female-friendly. I particularly like "I Take My Chances". I'm generally fond of the "Making It On Her Own" subgenre (He Thinks He'll Keep Her, She Let Herself Go, Xs and Os) and the "Time to Party" subgenre (Here for the Party, Sunday Morning After, 15 Minutes, Hell Yeah).

Although I have to say: love the chorus to "Friends in Low Places", find it very singable, but the narrator? Is a giant asshole. Yeah, just crash your ex's party and insult everyone there. Excellent idea. Well done, sir.

[Izzy]

There was meant to be a transition to "As far as general country music is concerned" there, before the subgenres. Hello, Friday night.

Also, Lee Greenwood can and should bite me. See also Toby Keith.

[hidden_urchin]

@ Jason

Seconding alienbooknose. Kitty could just be having an off day. Mine do the same every so often. Since his eating, drinking and behavior all seem normal to you then he is probably fine. If any of that changes then it's a good move to take him to a vet.

As an observant and concerned cat owner, you will notice if something is wrong and you'll know if it requires an emergency vet versus being able to wait to see your regular vet. I know how hard it is to hold to that after losing an animal suddenly though. (One of my dogs died suddenly a year ago.) It's really easy to lose confidence in your ability to recognize problems but you've still got it. {{hugs}}

I also keep an eye on my cats' coats. If they start looking scruffier than usual and don't smell normal it means they are sick most of the time... Please don't think I'm strange for smelling my cats.

[Lila]

MG: Captain Valor is amazing. I particularly like his ASL version of "I'm Your Moon".

[Samantha C]

But what bugs me worse is the (seemingly) constant assertion that "the music of real people is country", and "everyone's ancestors love our stuff"...So I am in *no* sense "getting back to my roots" when I listen to country music. "

Laima, it's funny, because I have a very similar little bristly reaction to people talking about comfort food and soul food. People always try to define it as 'food you ate when you were a kid' and 'food like your grandmother made' and things like that. Food that brings back memories. My grandmother never cooked a thing, and my mom doesn't much either. So much really good, comforting, wonderful food was never in my house because my mom was dieting. So while I can still enjoy comfort food for its own merits, and find it joyful and comforting, there's this rhetoric around it that makes me feel out of place and alienated.

I guess it happens every time anyone tries to extrapolate their life to everyone's. You're bound to come across someone who had it different, even in the most minor ways.

[ArianaDream]

TOTALLY off topic but I am infuriated by this post and wanted to share my irritation.

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/304/index/6661775&lf=8

I've never played Dragon Age and don't know much about it, but I AM an avid gamer - a straight female who loves RPGs in particular and has logged far too many hours on various RPGs. And I am tired of the privileged majority of straight male gamers whining about how girls only play Sims so RPG creators shouldn't cater to them. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

Money quote (that makes me want to SLAP someone): "The idea of privilege is ridiculous. The "privilege" always lies with the majority because if your goal is to make a game that will be liked by as many fans possible, then it makes sense to focus on that largest group. Why should one fan's enjoyment be more important than five others? It'd more accurate to call "privilege" the idea that some minority group gets special preference for political points. If you really want to be all-inclusive, then I don't see why homosexuals should get special preference while leaving other minority groups out."

Oh man I want to hit something now.

[MadGastronomer, who popped back up after a busy weekend to WTF misogyny and 'splaining]

Glad everybody's enjoying the ASL videos.

Captain Valor is amazing. I particularly like his ASL version of "I'm Your Moon".

I know, isn't it great? Have you heard that after Prop 8 passed, JoCo dedicated the song to those same-sex couples who had gotten married in California before that?

[MadGastronomer]

This post exists solely to change the autofill on my sig line, because I keep forgetting, and it's no longer appropriate.

[ArianaDream]

MadGastronomer, that's such a cool story! I LOVE "I'm Your Moon". One of my JoCo favorites. (Along with "The Future Soon".)

[P J Evans]

Not everyone who lives in the country even like country music. (My opinion of it is that it's Southern rural music going upscale, and doesn't have a whole lot to do with real country anything, any more than the geese-with-bows stuff that was around some years back, or the faux-naive art with crooked lettering.)

[Semperfiona]

@ArianaDream

To Bioware's credit, though, they apparently told "Straight Male Gamer" off.

http://www.nomorelost.org/2011/03/25/straight-male-gamer-told-to-get-over-it-by-bioware/

[ArianaDream]

Ooh, a good post to read on this. Thanks, Semperfiona. I DID read the Bioware writer's reply to the original poster and loved it...sadly, the OP still didn't really get it. I just shake my head sadly. And go off to read your link.

[Brad]

I spent five years in Japan (as an English teacher and, later, a magazine editor). Listened to a lot of Armed Forces Radio, which perforce played a lot of country music. (And right now all I can remember is "American Me" and "Baby's Got Her Blue Jeans On." Oh, and "I Knew The Bride When She Used To Rock And Roll.")

To think if I were there today I'd have to listen to Rush Limbaugh. (Like fun I would. Podcasts all the way.)

[ArianaDream]

Man, if I were in Japan as an English teacher (which I would love to do), I'd probably be listening to Jpop all day nonstop.

[Dav]

I would feel happier about the whole cancer/abuse stuff if I didn't feel like it was often so exploitive. It just feels off, although I suppose some of that could be residual social discomfort. To be fair, it shows up in older folk, too, like Knoxville Girl, which is essentially a ballad about murdering the girl you love. That one tops my squick list, just because the tune is kind of upbeat and hummable, which . . . yeah.

MG: Thank you so, so much for the ASL recommendations. I totally have a way to fill my weekend now.

[CZEdwards]

Sigh. MercuryBlue, it's all yours. Every bit of it.

My maternal family* loves their C&W something fierce. Which just adds another level of awful to family reunions; I find it physically painful**.

However... I end up reading the lyrics a lot, and getting exposure via my mother and my sisters. They all have Verizon phones that play songs while I'm waiting for them to pick up. They change their songs often. (And they wonder why I don't call...) I keep noticing how very romantic C&W is -- not in the Barry White, gets ya in the mood sense, but in the sense of being drawn from feeling, intuition, nostalgia, tradition. It tends to be intimate -- it may address a big social issue (such as above) but it does so from a individual narrative perspective. It's immediate. If it talks about war, it's talking about individual experiences and empathizes with the highly local effects. The protagonists are immediately identifiable to the listener as a peer. When it talks about relationships, it's from within the high complexity of a single relationship. Even in terms of instrumentation, C&W draws on intimacy -- I hear a lot more solo artists playing their own guitar and singing with no backup or other instrumentation in C&W than in any other genre save folk music. (I know there's a word for that type of performance, but I am blanking on it right now.) And it keeps the instrumentation limited -- I'm not holding my breath waiting for a C&W digeridoo, harpsichord and harmonium based band. (Though that would be COOL.)

I can't find much academic study of C&W (which I think is unfortunate; there's a lot to mine here) but I did find this, which contained this quote from Harold Reid, of the Statler Brothers (whom I have heard of; my parents were huge fans).

Reid puts his finger on a reigning country stereotype: the poor but proud undereducated rube who revels in his own inadaptability. For most of its existence, the "country" part of country music meant rural. And rural meant geographical isolation, family-centeredness, hard work, a slow-paced existence, and a visceral sense of place.

Country meant living in ways dictated more by nature-daylight and dark, changes in weather, seasons of growth and harvest-than by the clock. Lacking the control over events that education, wealth, social exposure, and the right connections conferred, country folk tended to be wary of "outsiders," self-conscious about their own worth, defensive, and fatalistic. They were victims before victimhood was cool. At least that's how the music portrayed them. To a degree, it still does.

Which makes me wonder how much of country's dark side doesn't come down to a marketing decision -- C&W is huge business. It hasn't been that long since the Dixie Chicks took massive heat for not conforming to the trope. There's major (emotional and financial) investment in both playing to the romantic, nostalgic sensibility as well as replenishing it. How much does the music appeal to the listener because it speaks to the listener's experience and social reality and how much does the music shape the listener's experience? C&W has been using a lot of the same tropes, both lyrically and stylistically, for 50+ years; that's an enormous emotional well that doesn't seem to be running dry. There is feedback, otherwise the audience would wander off and the industry would move on.

My pop genre of choice is future-pop (which is a subset of EBM, electronic body music, which is techno heavily influenced by classical). Future-pop tends towards the social-universal-communal; it uses the wide lens for big issues. Its sensibility is much more Age of Enlightenment than Romantic Era (an imperfect analogy, since the Romantics were a reaction to the Enlightenment, but...) My mother, the country fan, finds my music choices cold and impersonal, emotionally difficult and distant while I find her preference smothering and too particularist. But Mom and I have vastly different tastes in most media. (I've accepted it; she brought home a changeling from the hospital...)

*including my sisters, so it's not a generational or urban/rural split.

**In infancy, the radio would make me scream, to the point where my mother and grandparents spent my first year not turning on the house/car radios when I was awake and within earshot****, or playing their very few non-country LPs.*** It's either the prevalence of the pedal steel, or the half-diminished sevenths -- C&W uses both heavily. Which means I can listen to covers of country music assuming transposition ... I sort of like the Guitar Hero version of "Devil Went Down to Georgia", which is transposed, but the original, and the Primus version, make me slightly nauseated, headachy and anxious. It's not just country. A lot of 50s and 60s era gospel, Tejano, bluegrass, mariachi and juju have similar effects. It's like I took +6 on hearing, but have a -15 sonic resistance as a consequence.

***which I can still name, because there were so few. A Reader's Digest classical collection, the soundtrack to Zefarelli's Romeo and Juliet, and the Irish Rovers. My family NEVER wants to hear any of the above again, but I still love the 1812. That's all of the non-painful music I heard until I was seven years old, we finally had cable, and I got control of the remote. Two hours of The Eurythmics, New Order, Duran Duran and Elvis Costello warped me forever.

****This was actually an Issue because we lived within spitting distance of the Middle of Nowhere. NBC was reliable, the other two TV stations weren't, and radio was the connection to the outer world. It was always on, especially in tornado season. The farmhouse where I spent my first year still gets very poor radio reception -- one station, plays country and the farm reports.

[J Neo Marvin]

There is no sense in either of these songs, or in any country song about religion that I can think of, that Christianity might not be the One True Way.

"Let The Mystery Be" by Iris DeMent?

[Johnny Adroit]

CZEdwards covered most of my point, so I'll elaborate a little.

I don't listen to much country music. Too much of it sounds like generic soft rock with a southern/Texas accent. However, most of this post seems to consist of, "This music doesn't represent me, so I object to it." Country lyrics, much like the blues and folk music it springs from, is much more narrative-based and (auto)biographical than other genres. Of course the perspective of the music is going to be much less universal and inclusive. "The music is about my life. If you relate, that's gravy."

I don't see the problem with the line "No need to make a million, just be thankful to be working," or anything else with the Montgomery Gentry song. He's not proud of war, but of his dad. He's not proud that he's not a millionaire, but of the fact that he can provide for his family. To have pride in one's life is not to begrudge others theirs.

When evaluating a genre of music, especially one as popular as country, you have to be wary of taking the popular acts as representative of the whole. The popular acts are those that are marketed. Marketers promote those who are not far from mainstream tastes and opinions in order to maximize their return on investment. Hence the religious, pro-military, and woman-objectifying themes---and, really, that last one is common to all popular music genres.

My favorite country performers are Tracy Grammar and Dave Carter. They are very different from the popular acts:

Hey Ho

bring your kids and coddled pets
bouncin babes in bassinets
we'll play a game with tanks and jets
better yet, bayonets

marchin bands and color guards
funerals in your own backyard
don't forget your credit card
johnny, hold the line

hey ho, so it goes, the point of sale, the puppet show
the merchant kings of war and woe have turned their hands to labor
sound out the trumpet noise, the cannons bark and jump for joy
someone's dread and darlin boy has fallen on his saber

Gentle Arms of Eden

on a sleepy endless ocean when the world lay in a dream
there was rhythm in the splash and roll but not a voice to sing
so the moon shone on the breakers and the morning warmed the waves
till a single cell did jump and hum for joy as though to say

this is my home, this is my only home
this is the only sacred ground that i have ever known
and should i stray in the dark night alone
rock me goddess in the gentle arms of eden

then the day shone bright and rounder till the one turned into two
and the two into ten thousand things, and old things into new
and on some virgin beach head one lonesome critter crawled
and he looked about and shouted out in his most astonished drawl

this is my home ...

Hey! A song about evolution!

[Andrew Glasgow]

@Mercuryblue

Despite all this, I still love country music. I wish someone would tell me why.

No clue. Once in a while a song comes along like 'Independence Day' that makes me sit up and take notice... but I can listen to artists like P!nk and hear the same thing in almost every single song she sings.

I do like the twangy, banjo-and-acoustic guitar, foot stomping, honky-tonk-piano style of classic country, country rock and bluegrass, but most modern country fans probably have no clue who Johnny Cash, Willie Nelson, CCR, or Bela Fleck are.

[Nenya]

Martina McBride has some really great stuff--I've been having "City of Love" running through my head all week:

Every street we take is paved with truth
If a mountain's in our way, that's a mountain we move
Baby, there ain't nothing we can't do
Since me and you built this city of love

I also like some Shania Twain, though that may be partly because of the amazing poster included with the CD of "Up" with her in a ripped white tank top, which was highly intriguing to my coming-out-as-bi college self.

I have times when I can't stand the musical style--the word that comes to mind is "twangy", which may be the guitar? I'm not sure if that's due to my hearing or not; it's possible there are pleasant harmonics I'm not hearing and so I focus on the unpleasant ones, I'm not sure. There are other times when it seems quite comforting, though. I used to run the Country Music Channel on TV late at night--all music videos--when I couldn't sleep.

In general I don't think of country music as my music, but then I remember my Martina McBride CD, so. I completely agree with Laiima that the insistence that "this is how everybody grew up" is extremely annoying. Even though in my case I did grow up in the country! Just not on country music. I'm from northern Canada, not the southern US: we have farms too!

[Kit Whitfield]

"The idea of privilege is ridiculous. The "privilege" always lies with the majority because if your goal is to make a game that will be liked by as many fans possible, then it makes sense to focus on that largest group. Why should one fan's enjoyment be more important than five others? It'd more accurate to call "privilege" the idea that some minority group gets special preference for political points. If you really want to be all-inclusive, then I don't see why homosexuals should get special preference while leaving other minority groups out."

Wow, my Derailing for Dummies bingo card is almost full from a single paragraph! Nice work.

[imin]

awesome song and singers.

[Ruby]

{{{{Jason}}}}

And man, are there ANY other dog people around here??? :D

I Am Not A Veterinarian, but I would figure if everything else about an animal is normal, but there's an accident or some other poop problem that just lasts a day, it's not to worry about. Animals have little digestive upsets sometimes, just like we all do. :D

[Ruby]

@ArianaDream:

http://formerconservative.wordpress.com/2011/03/27/do-not-speak-for-me-straight-male-gamer/

[Jason]

Thanks everyone.

He seems ok this morning. I think it was just a fluke. I would not be this way if I hadn't have had that one cat (which was my favorite cat I've ever had and who wasn't very old at all, maybe 8) die suddenly on me. He got really sick on a Thursday night and he was gone by Sunday.

It was more painful than most of the human deaths that were close to me since this was the first time anyone I saw EVERY DAY died and I ended up staying up all night looking after him wondering if I had done all I can. There were about 3 vet visits before I had to put him down.

It just makes me paranoid when something is off, because I don't think I could handle repeating that experience this soon, but he seems ok now.

[Jason]

On topic:

"Let The Mystery Be" by Iris DeMent?

I love that song. I also love her "Our Town" song that was used in the last episode of Northern Exposure which is one of my alltime favorite shows.

Let the Mystery Be
Our Town

Does anyone like Nanci Griffith? I saw her live recently and it was fantastic though being in the second row directly across from her helped. (-:

Love at the Five and Dime
Lonestar State of Mind (My biggest dissappointment with the concert was that she did not do this one)

[Jason]

Oh and here's a hilarious duet with John Prine and Iris Dement.

[Mmy]

@Jason: About your cat -- having lost one cat due to a sudden kidney problem (this was years ago, they probably could "do" something today) and nursed two old cats through their declining years I think I get some of what you are feeling.

We watched the litter box very carefully with both of the elderly cats -- and found there was a degree of variation as to the "quality" of their output. Variations such as you describe were sometimes caused by the cat ingesting something outside their normal diet (grass, a bug, an elastic band....) If the cat's appetite is normal, the stools are back to normal and its appetite is normal I wouldn't make a special visit to the vet. I would keep a special eye on things for a while.

[Kubrick's Rube]

This post pretty well reflects my relationship with hip-hop, which for good and ill has many thematic similarities with country music (working class and outside-the-law narratives, regional chauvinism, keep-it-real talk, unquestioned gender assumptions, rampant god talk, homophobia, overt political stances), even if they sometimes come from opposite directions.

I love hip-hop, but even my favorite artists make me cringe more often than I'd like.

[sarah]

I've never been much of a country fan. I'm more on the folk side, so if the bands I like are categorized as "country," they're usually folk-leaning. Crooked Still--has anyone heard of them? I think they probably are in this category. And, you know, the usual suspects, like Johnny Cash and Alison Krauss and Patty Griffin. Perhaps "Americana" would be a good category here.

I think MercuryBlue hit on the reason I don't like country: it's often jingoistic and promotes this idea that all good, "real" people love country music. Laima put that well, with:

[[But what bugs me worse is the (seemingly) constant assertion that "the music of real people is country", and "everyone's ancestors love our stuff".]]

Yeah. My family is definitely not country, at least not this type of country. *My* ancestors love Andrea Bocelli, thanks very much.
My dad, however, likes to make up ridiculous country songs, complete with "my dog died, and my wife died, and my truck broke down," and play them on the guitar. I suppose this just goes to prove that I come from a weird, weird family.

[Onymous]

@Ruby, Don't worry you're not completely alone. While I've loved the cats I've had or lived with I grew up in Alaska. Dogs have an enormous place in the culture myth of Alaska. Texans have horses, Alaskans have dogs.

As to country. I love me some Johnny Cash and Loretta Lynn. But by and large while I love harmonicas, banjos and dobros 995 of country is just way too... assumptive of an audience that is not me.

[hapax]

I love "classic country" -- Hank Williams, Johnny Cash, the Carter family, the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band, Old Crow Medicine Show -- although that's probably sliding into gospel on one side and folk on the other.

I could listen to bluegrass pickin' all day long, so long as nobody opens their mouth and starts "singing".

And man, are there ANY other dog people around here???

[waves hello] I like cats fine, but they threaten Painful Asphyxiation to spouse. But dogs -- I think I've been without a dog or three in the house for only a scant few weeks of my life.

It just doesn't feel right to not have a pooch around.

[sarah]

@hapax: OCMS! I like them. My dad and brother like playing "Wagon Wheel" together, so hearing that song reminds me of family.

OCMS went on tour with Gillian Welch a while back, and their stuff together is really good--you can get it on YouTube.

[Launcifer]

And man, are there ANY other dog people around here???

I used to have a Newfoundland and, well, one of my life goals is to own a house large enough to stable four. So, yes, I am something of a dog person. Country, not so much, though I should probably pay attention to any genre that can give me a title like The second time she said "Shalom", I knew she meant goodbye.

[sarah]

[[The second time she said "Shalom", I knew she meant goodbye.]]

That's...so iambic.

[Kristin]

Despite all this, I still love country music. I wish someone would tell me why.

Heh, good luck with that one. So, what surprises me here is that you seem familiar mostly with commercial country radio-type country? And I, eh... Just no no no no. It is so many levels of wrong. I love country music, but you seem to be missing out on some of its best stuff. It sounds like you feel like there is little worth loving in it, but, oh there is!

Gillian Welch writes about God sometimes, but I don't get the sense that she's preaching to anyone, if only because her voice is so artless and sad. She sings, by the way, on the new Decemberists album, The King is Dead, a country-tinged departure for the band.

And, of course, there's Johnny Cash, whose Jesus at least seems to identify with oppressed people... I get the idea that this is why he wanted, for example, to record an album at Folsom Prison--not because he wanted to preach to anyone, but because he identified with these as his people, people like him.

And there are some lovely all-female string/bluegrass bands: The Be Good Tanyas, the genius Abigail Washburn (and her band, Uncle Earl), The Wailin' Jennys (Get it? Waylon Jennings?).

The Carolina Chocolate Drops--an African-American old time string band--reinterpret and reclaim some of the old minstrel songs to astonishing effect. Their lead singer's classical training, btw, comes through all over the masterful instrumentation... And, my god, her voice...

The outcasts of country music have always been its best. Townes Van Zandt? And his greatest fan, outlaw country singer Steve Earle? Who is married to Allison Moorer who is the sister of Shelby Lynne... (All fantastic artists.)

Lemme see... *The* first alt country band, Uncle Tupelo, and its offspring--Jeff Tweedy of Wilco and Jay Farrar of Son Volt. Speaking of politics: If you haven't heard the country-folk collaboration between Billy Bragg and Wilco that sets some of Woody Guthrie's poetry to music (Mermaid Avenue), you are sadly missing out. It's an album that makes people feel lucky to be alive.

And he's known for being a bit of a jackass, but I have loved Ryan Adams since the first time I heard "Sweet Carolina."

Tift Merritt has gone all Norah Jones-bland these days, but her second album, Tambourine, is a marvel of blues-country rock. And one of my favorite albums ever.

I'm partial to bluesy country myself, so I adore The Deadstring Brothers... Also Grace Potter and the Nocturnals. Oh, and the wonderful Michelle Malone has been doing country blues ever since she released Stompin' Ground as "Moanin' Michelle Malone and the Low Down Dirty Georgia Revue." Her best is Sugarfoot.

Old Crow Medicine Show, the old time band, is just fun. And there are other fun bluegrass boy bands that riff on punk music--the Hackensaw Boys are great fun. The Avett Brothers used to do this kind of thing, but are currently known for their sincere sad love ballads and country rock songs.

And how have I not mentioned Neko Case yet??? ZOMG, NEKO CASE. Whose voice is unlike any other... And I think all of us queer women are required to have a Very. Serious. Crush. on her. You must hear her solo stuff if you haven't.

Brandi Carlisle's voice is lovely--she sounds a lot like k.d. lang, but with more interesting songs.

Ruthie Foster--she does a blend of R & B, soul and country blues. Amazing voice.

Again wrt politics: I've been wanting to tell people about the new-ish Anais Mitchell collaboration--Hadestown. It's a folk rock opera (which sounds weirder than it is). She collaborates with the guy from Bon Iver, Gregg Brown and Ani Difranco in one of the most interesting new things I've heard in years: The story of Orpheus and Eurydice. And it doesn't even sound like Ani! Normally I cannot stand her voice, but she's great here. This album includes one of the most striking political songs I've maybe EVER heard, The Wall, and pretty clearly about the US wall at the Mexican border and other such "walls" that we use to exclude. It's a call-and-response gospel-style song (I should mention that the album borrows from all kinds of American-roots styles), with Hades at the helm (And Gregg Brown's deep, gritty voice is the only one that I think could ever work here:

Why do we build the wall?
My children
My children
Why do we build the wall?

Why do we build the wall?
We build the wall to keep us free
That’s why we build the wall
We build the wall to keep us free

How does the wall keep us free?
My children
My children
How does the wall keep us free?

How does the wall keep us free?
The wall keeps out the enemy
And we build the wall to keep us free
That’s why we build the wall

Who do we call the enemy?
My children
My children
Who do we call the enemy?

Who do we call the enemy?
The enemy is poverty
And the wall keeps out the enemy
And we build the wall to keep us free
That’s why we build the wall

Because we have and they have not
My children
My children
Because they want what we have got

Because we have and they have not
Because they want what we have got
The enemy is poverty
And the wall keeps out the enemy
And we build the wall to keep us free
That’s why we build the wall
We build the wall to keep us free

What do we have that they should want?
My children
My children
What do we have that they should want?

What do we have that they should want?
We have a wall to work upon
We have work and they have none
And our work is never done
My children
My children
And the war is never won
The enemy is poverty
The wall keeps out the enemy
And we build the wall to keep us free
That’s why we build the wall
We build the wall to keep us free
We build the wall to keep us free

Ah-hem... I am obsessed with Americana/roots music/alt-country, indie country, outlaw country, blues country, below-the-radar bluegrass, etc. Obsessed.

Depending on the artist, the politics can get quite sexist (I'm talkin' to you, Ryan Adams!), but most of what I've listed here is politically progressive if political at all. Not a lot of military glorification in it, if nothing else.

[Kristin]

@ Sarah: Crooked Still--has anyone heard of them?

Yes!

[Kristin]

Oh, also... Of those, the only ones who really reference Christianity in their music are Gillian Welch, Johnny Cash and The Wailin' Jennys. From what I remember (and I don't remember every single song), the rest are very secular. Ruthie Foster sometimes sings old spirituals/civil rights-era anthems.

[Lou Doench]

I grew up with the radio country of the 70's and 80's, Kenny Rogers, Barbara Mandrell etc. My Dad was the nes director at WUBE in Cincinnati, so that was what was on the radio. Its definitely "comfort music" to me. It's certainly not the music I love (OTR is the music I love). But I think country done well, with talent and love is just as valid as any other style. I think the problem that Country(tm) has is similar to what the Republican party has. They have been pandering to the crazies for so long that they have lost the rest of us. Too many people hear Toby Keiths awful jingoism, rather than Willie Nelson's thoughtful ramblings. BTW, listen to Willies new album "Country Music" to hear what country should sound like.

[Laiima (same old Laima, but I'm standardizing to match w Patheos & Pandagon)]

@Jason, Mr Laiima loves Nancy Griffith, Alison Krauss, The Dixie Dregs, Johnny Cash; he gets misty-eyed over anyone singing "Rocky Top" and "My Old Kentucky Home".

I like Deana Carter, one or two Johnny Cash tunes, Keith Urban, Terri Clark. Grew up listening to CCR (never heard them called country, though). Is John Denver country? I love his stuff. Like 'Southern rock' for some reason: *love* .38 Special and the Eagles, like a few songs each from the Allman Brothers, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Alabama. Although sometimes when I hear the lyrics, I wince. "Sweet Home Alabama" is pretty awful.

I like bluegrass, but like hapax, not a big fan of the lyrics. Do like Steve Martin's banjo songs. Some of those lyrics are fun.

[Kristin]

OH, btw, though not a great fan of the White Stripes, I've thoroughly enjoyed Jack White's country projects: Van Lear Rose with Loretta Lynne. And his fourth or fifth side band, The Dead Weather.

Others I like: Drive-By Truckers, Jason Isbell, Southern Culture on the Skids...

Hem's stuff is just lovely.

Jolie Holland.

Australian country-folk band, The Waifs.

Jim Lauderdale and his projects: The Pine Valley Causmonauts and their three-disc anti-death penalty benefit album. The Waco Brothers.

Todd Snider. The heartbreaking,rollicking beautiful lyricism of Todd Snider. Who wrote a song called Conservative Christian Right-Wing Republican Straight White American Males. And another called Happy New Year that has the wonderful lyric, "I'm evangelical agnostic now." These are laugh out loud "I'm so glad someone finally said this" songs, but then in the same breath he'll come out with songs like "Play a Train Song" about past struggles with addiction... That kind of hit you in a visceral way and stick around for a while.

[Laiima (same old Laima, but I'm standardizing to match w Patheos & Pandagon)]

@Samantha C, I have a similar issue with "soul food" in that the food that feeds *my* soul, while it is food my grandmother made, was ethnic Lithuanian/Polish/Jewish food, and not anything I can find, outside of Chicagoland. A big steaming plate of kugelis with gobs of sour cream, black bread with butter, and a mug of tea with lemon and honey -- heaven. Last time I had all that was a visit to Sagil's (Lithuanian restaurant in Burbank IL) when we were in town for a family wedding 3 years ago. Pierogies, cheese blintzes, bacon buns, mushroom soup. Such good memories, but most people have never heard of any of these foods.

[Kristin]

Pierogies, cheese blintzes, bacon buns, mushroom soup. Such good memories, but most people have never heard of any of these foods.

They haven't? Seriously?

So, all of my obsessions seem to be coming up in this thread. Food. Music.

*waves at Ruby* Dog person here!

@Laiima: I'm probably not the best judge of what foods people have heard about, I guess... I collect and read cookbooks for fun. One of my biggest heroes is Mark Bittman. So. Yeah.

[Jenny Islander]

We get three Christian, two country, one pop, one alternative-ish, and one public station here. One thing I've noticed is that, if you ignore the Jesus-is-my-boyfriend glurge, only the country stations feature men who are not ashamed to sing about how wholeheartedly, goofily in love they are. Also, country songs talk about getting middle-aged, getting old, and dying without larding the topics with aaaaaaangst.

[Laiima (same old Laima, but I'm standardizing to match w Patheos & Pandagon)]

@Jenny Islander: only the country stations feature men who are not ashamed to sing about how wholeheartedly, goofily in love they are. Also, country songs talk about getting middle-aged, getting old, and dying without larding the topics with aaaaaaangst.

Good points, all.

[Caryb]

I agree with MercuryBlue here. However, I would suggest that the problem is less "Country Music" and just "music." I cannot think of a single genre of music that does not have plenty of sexism, simply because lots of people make music and some of them are assholes.

Popular music particularly, due to sexism in the culture and other things y'all already know about.

Also, top 40 country blows big chunks- with a few notable exceptions. I like Randy Travis a great deal, and I have a (shameful) love for Toby Keith. And I admit, there are times I put on "Courtesy of the Red White and Blue" and just indulge in three or four minutes of "America! Fuck Yeah!"

(was there a point to this comment? Noooo clue.)

[Nenya]

I love the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band! Their version of "And So It Goes (With Everything But Love)" is one of my favourite songs *evar*.

Is it insulting to country music fans to tell the one country music joke I know? If you play a country song backwards, you get your truck back, and your dog back, and your house back, and your wife back...

[Winter]

Here's an interesting take on country music, especially the "America! Fuck Yeah" strain: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6riY-103vbc

I'll confess to liking some country songs but detesting pop-y country.

[Laiima (same old Laima, but I'm standardizing to match w Patheos & Pandagon)]

I will confess to the guilty pleasure of "I Wanna Talk About Me" and "My List" by Toby Keith, and "Trashy Women" by Confederate Railroad.

[MercuryBlue]

Nenya: Rascal Flatts' "Backwards".

Yes, most of my country music exposure comes from the radio. I've never heard of most of the people y'all are recommending, and I've only heard one song by Neko Case and I love it but I had no idea anyone would call it country.

[Caryb]

As far as modern country performers go: Alan Jackson is pretty good, and is, by all accounts, a pretty fantastic person. So is Randy Travis.

Hank Williams Jr is a great disappointment to me. He started out with songs like "I've been down" which had the great lines "Reaganomics and plastic people makin' good luck hard to find" and
"Well the preacher man's a talkin on the TV
He's beggin for my only dime,
I'd take another shot of whiskey
If I thought it'd get him of my mind."

And then went on to cover his own song "Family Tradition" as "McCain/Palin Tradition" This makes me sad.

[Kristin]

Anybody into Lady Antebellum? I don't understand their appeal *at all.* Plus, their name just makes me wince. This is another problem, especially with popular/radio country music: romantic throwbacks to the Antebellum period, Confederacy nostalgia, etc.

And I really do not like the, eh, Country Music Conceived as Bland Pop trend either... Taylor Swift makes me nauseous. I just... "She wears short skirts, I wear t-shirts"...

And like everyone else, I love the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band.

[Caryb]

@Nenya: there are many similar jokes about blues songs, as well.

[Kristin]

I've only heard one song by Neko Case and I love it but I had no idea anyone would call it country.

It was more her earlier stuff, which was quite a bit twangier. When she recorded with her band as Neko Case and Her Boyfriends. Also, she's done some stuff with the alt country band, The Sadies.

Speaking of The Sadies... John Doe (from X) now writes alt country music. And really very well. (He's got an album of covers with The Sadies).

Oh, and Mary Gauthier? Anyone here listen to her?

[MadGastronomer]

I'm a dog person! I've got a Lab/Newf mix, who's the size of a Lab with all the hair and giant paws of a Newf. Since I wanted a Newf, but don't have enough space for one*, he's perfect for me, plus he's friendly and bright and generally awesome. His name is Uther.

*People keep telling me that Newfs are very lazy dogs and don't need so much room because they just lay around. I say, no, no, you don't understand. I have a townhouse. I don't have enough room for one to lay around.

[Kristin]

Anyway, Neko Case still gets classed as alt-country, though her newer stuff isn't nearly as country-sounding as the older stuff. And she gets interviews in No Depression (the major alt-country publication) and that kind of thing. I do like her country stuff, but my favorite songs of hers are the creepy non-country ones, like "Deep Red Bells."

[Jason]

Now y'all are talking my language: bluegrass, folk, and alt-country

You've named so many artists I love that I can't even count them all. I kind of hate the top 40 pop type of country. Its like a Tea Party rally set to nasal singing.

[Kristin]

However... Deep Red Bells turns out to be a lot more country-influenced than I'd thought:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3ShWvRLYsM&feature=related

@ Jason: Are you from the South too?

[Caryb]

And of course, there is the perfect country western verse:

"I was drunk the day my mom got out of prison,
and I went to pick her up in the rain.
But before I could make it to the station in my pickup truck
she got run over by a dammed old train"

The rest of the song is pretty kickass too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEo8poVlQrM

[Amaryllis]

MadG:I'm a dog person! I've got a Lab/Newf mix, who's the size of a Lab with all the hair and giant paws of a Newf.
And the drool of a Newf, no doubt?

I haven't read the thread--maybe later, when I'll have time to throw some folk/trad stuff into the mix-- have you ever heard country/western sung in Gaelic?-- but I had to jump in in memory of a Lab/Newf that I once knew. Sweetest dog in the world, "Crusher" by name and mushy by nature. I still cherish the memory of introducing him to my then-five-year-old daughter: they looked at each other eye to eye for a moment, then it was licks and pats and woofs and giggles and love at first sight.

We used to have both dogs and cats. Now we have neither, while I dither over whether I can commit to cleaning a litter box every day, or getting up to walk the dog every day. I got lazy when I got old, I guess.

[Kristin]

Oh, here's the studio version of that song. It's better: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DPfrOv4fqM

It's so creepy, but it sticks with you, and I think it's one of the more memorable of her songs. Anyway, I remember hearing her interviewed about it. She said it was about a serial killer who was targeting people in her neighborhood when she was living on the street.

Pretty Girls has a similar creepy sound:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yYRwUiNmy0

She said she wrote it about abortion--seeing young girls waiting at a Planned Parenthood to get abortions, against the backdrop of protesters outside, etc.

[Brin (not Meir)]

>Anybody into Lady Antebellum? I don't understand their appeal *at all.* Plus, their name just makes me wince. This is another problem, especially with popular/radio country music: romantic throwbacks to the Antebellum period, Confederacy nostalgia, etc.<

I've only ever heard of them through ads at Walmart. (Pictures only, no audio, so I don't think I've ever heard the music.) I assumed it was a brain reference; now that I've gone to look it up, it seems there isn't actually a part of the brain called the antebellum. I must have gotten it confused with cerebellum.

[Ruby]

Amaryllis: I haven't read the thread--maybe later, when I'll have time to throw some folk/trad stuff into the mix-- have you ever heard country/western sung in Gaelic?-- but I had to jump in in memory of a Lab/Newf that I once knew. Sweetest dog in the world, "Crusher" by name and mushy by nature. I still cherish the memory of introducing him to my then-five-year-old daughter: they looked at each other eye to eye for a moment, then it was licks and pats and woofs and giggles and love at first sight.

Awww...that reminds me of when we introduced our Wheaten Terrier to my then-two-year-old cousin. They were almost eye-to-eye, and proceeded to have a day of races, back and forth across the family room. :D

[MercuryBlue]

Brin: Yeah, 'antebellum' means 'before the war' and is usually used in reference to the pre-Civil-War South. Lady Antebellum would then be a slavery-era Southern belle.

[Kristin]

@ Brin: Huh. Are you in the US?

Anyway, it can refer to a kind of architecture popular during that period (the old plantation houses), but whether or not it's specifically about buildings, it always refers to the pre-Civil War slave holding aristocracy in the south.

Similar problematic name wrt The Dixie Chicks."Dixie" is maybe even a little more troubling than "Antebellum" as a *chosen band name* because it appears in several minstrel songs glorifying the old south. Antebellum is the term used by historians.

In any case, casual nods to that era in the south come up all the time in commercial country music, and it surprises me that they're not critiqued for choices like these more often.

[Brin (not Meir)]

>Huh. Are you in the US?<

I lived in New Jersey until about 3 1/2 years ago, and now live in Ontario. The Lady Antebellum ads were in Ontarian Walmarts.

[Kristin]

I liked what bloggers at Racialicious said about Lady Antebellum:

http://www.racialicious.com/2010/01/14/lady-antebellum-and-the-glorification-of-the-pre-civil-war-south/

[P J Evans]

I have to admit that 'antebellum' sounds like it ought to be part of some peoples' brains. Not people i want to associate much with, though....

[Laiima (same old Laima, but I'm standardizing to match w Patheos & Pandagon)]

I now live just south of the Mason-Dixon line, although Maryland stayed with the Union. I'm kind of perplexed why Civil War nostalgia is so big here.

Both sides of my family are relatively-recent immigrants to the US, such that our history in America is still less than 100 years long. So I've never been able to feel like the Civil War (or the Revolutionary War, come to that) has anything to do with me. I do have relatives who fought for the US in WW2.

[Kristin]

So, again, @ Brin: You grew up in the U.S. and attended primary and secondary public schools (and not the Bob Jones or Bill Gothard homeschooling curriculums) in this country, and they didn't teach you about the Antebellum period? I... I do not mean this as an insult. It's just I've been sputtering in disbelief since I first saw your comment, and if this is no longer taught, that makes me very worried.

[Kristin]

I now live just south of the Mason-Dixon line, although Maryland stayed with the Union. I'm kind of perplexed why Civil War nostalgia is so big here.

I've lived in Rockville and Frederick, and I noticed this as well.

We do not really have a lot of Civil War nostalgia in NC, at least not in the Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill area where I live (admittedly different from many other parts of the state). I've always been a bit shocked traveling up through Virginia and seeing so many Civil War reenactments and tourist plantation home tours. And states designating Confederacy Celebration Days! wtf?

NC is a weird case. It was part of the slave holding system, but its economy was a sharecropping--not plantation-run--one. Meaning lots of very small farms, and most everyone was poor. But also that people weren't as invested in the Confederate system. Many people from here deserted and fought for the Union armies and militias. Most people in the Appalachian region never had slaves, and many of them fought against the Confederacy. Members of the same families fought on different sides. I don't think that period is seen in NC, even among those of us who have white privilege, as a glorious time in our history. It puzzles and sort of shocks me when I find it being celebrated elsewhere.

[Lila]

I second the love for the Carolina Chocolate Drops. I also LOVE their collaboration with the Luminescent Orchestrii.

In general, I prefer bluegrass to country (and I mean everything from Bill Monroe singing "Long Black Veil" to The Cleverlys' cover of "All the Single Ladies").

**waves at Kristin, Ruby and Laima** I am a dog person too (formerly a rescuer). And not only am I obsessed with food, most of my favorite authors are too. I even bought "Lobscouse and Spotted Dog" (which it's a gastronomic companion to Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey and Maturin series).

[Kristin]

I also LOVE their collaboration with the Luminescent Orchestrii.

*swoons* I had not heard that before. LOVE. IT.

[Lonespark]

I tried reading through the whole thread, but haven't made it yet. Yet again a subject very dear to my heart comes up when I'm busy and sick. Oh well.

To me country is comfort music because it's the only thing played on the station in the very, very small not-quite-town in Vermont where my grandparents lived. It's the music of digging potatoes and chopping wood, to me. And the stuff on that station tends to be a few years out of date, and request-heavy, so there was a lot of great music.

Some of the best stuff I've come across has been on radio shows like The Edge of Country (Dar Williams, John Prine, the Austin Lounge Lizards...although I realized afterward that one of my pastors growing up played a fair amount of John Prine in church. I've always kind of thought of "Paradise" as a hymn, maybe for that reason. He played Woody Guthrie, too...)

And there used to be another show, I think on the same Boston station, called Sunday Morning Country Oldies. That's where I first heard Loretta Lynn, George Jones...I think the first song I ever heard on that show was "Hungry Eyes." I...just...what...I knew that was the stuff. My parents were pretty big into Johnny Cash. Some of the songs my mom used to sing me to sleep with were stuff he recorded. You can take away a lot from me, if you'll leave me Loretta, Johnny, and Merle. Oh, and maybe Dolly too. Actually, once I start making a list, I'll be here all day.

I also spent every. single. summer. in my youth driving back and forth across the US, camping and sightseeing. Most of the radio you can get is country. I really like so much, and yet so much makes me want to punch someone. One of my favorite things about living in Kentuckiana was the All Bluegrass All the Time station.

[Lonespark]

Clearly I need more music. Good recs in this here thread.

[kisekileia]

@Kristin: I believe Brin's only sixteen or so, so her high school education would have been exclusively Canadian. I don't know if this is true in the U.S, but in Ontario most of the compulsory history gets taught in grades 6-10, and it's all Canadian history. Someone who grew up in Ontario but moved to the States for eighth grade would certainly miss out on a lot of Canadian history.

As for Lady Antebellum, I like "Need You Now" but find the band name rather problematic. I have always lived in Canada, and despite taking history right through the International Baccalaureate--including an American history course--I learned new things about the word "antebellum" from the comments to this post.

[Brin (not Meir)]

>You grew up in the U.S. and attended primary and secondary public schools (and not the Bob Jones or Bill Gothard homeschooling curriculums) in this country, and they didn't teach you about the Antebellum period?<

I'm seventeen. I have never attended public school, and my family doesn't use any particular curriculum in our homeschooling. Some of my textbooks may have used the word antebellum (especially the earlier, more America-centric ones), but if so it didn't stick in my memory.

Time for bedtime prep. See you tomorrow.

[Amaryllis]

Kenny Chesney's "Everybody Wants to Go to Heaven"
So I googled the lyrics-- oh, it's that joke! Which I've always heard in the Irish, not to say Catholic, version:

Father Murphy walks into a pub in Donegal, and says to the first man he meets, "Do you want to go to heaven?" The man said, "I do Father." The priest said, "Then stand over there against the wall." Then the priest asked the second man, "Do you want to got to heaven?" "Certainly, Father," was the man's reply. "Then stand over there against the wall," said the priest. Then Father Murphy walked up to O'Toole and said, "Do you want to go to heaven?" O'Toole said, "No, I don't, Father." The priest said, "I don't believe this. You mean to tell me that when you die you don't want to go to heaven?"

O'Toole said, "Oh, when I die, yes. I thought you were getting a group together to go right now."

to believe that putting money in the church plate pays for the sins committed earlier that weekend
That part, on the other hand, made my jaw drop. Next thing you know they'll be selling indulgences in the narthex after prayer meeting!

---
Dav: like Knoxville Girl, which is essentially a ballad about murdering the girl you love. That one tops my squick list, just because the tune is kind of upbeat and hummable, which . . . yeah
Those murder ballads are supposed to squick you out, kinda the horror movies of their day (only shorter) -- you know, the ones where the "fast" teenagers are always the first to get killed? Same thing with the Knoxville Girl, and Pretty Polly. And poor Rose Connelly, poisoned, stabbed and drowned: he must have really meant to make sure. With those songs, you get the ghoulish thrill of the murder, the warning to young women to behave themselves or else, the satisfaction of justice done when the murderer ends on the gallows, all wrapped up in a pretty little tune. No wonder they were so popular.

[Brin (not Meir)]

One more thing: while the theoretical Canada-to-America immigrant would miss Canadian history, the more obvious matter might be the lack of American history. Maybe not so much that way what with all the exposure to American stuff, but I've certainly had a lot of catching up to do.
You'd think the Halifax Explosion, most explodiest man-made explosion in recorded history, would have at least been mentioned. (One of the first things I did upon moving was go to the local library and check out all the Dear Canada books about things I hadn't heard of. That's how I learned of the Halifax Explosion; also the Home Children.)

[Amaryllis]

@Ruby: Awww.

@Lonespark: hope you feel better soon.

@Brin: I left New Jersey before you were born, but in my day, the war the people cared about was the American Revolution. That was the one fought on our own ground, as it were.

I feel sorry for anybody who's never had homemade pierogies.

Lila: I even bought "Lobscouse and Spotted Dog" (which it's a gastronomic companion to Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey and Maturin series).
Which it's a wonderful book-- although I've never had the nerve to cook anything from it.

[Rebecca]

I can't stand most country music. That said, what I like of it, I love. I am completely unashamed of my massive love of Dolly Parton. Also a fan of Neil Young, Emmylou Harris, Crooked Still. Need to become better acquainted with Johnny Cash.

[Kristin]

@Kristin: I believe Brin's only sixteen or so, so her high school education would have been exclusively Canadian. I don't know if this is true in the U.S, but in Ontario most of the compulsory history gets taught in grades 6-10, and it's all Canadian history. Someone who grew up in Ontario but moved to the States for eighth grade would certainly miss out on a lot of Canadian history.

Ah, thank you, I didn't realize that. That does change things, sorry. I thought Brin was older. And, yeah, education varies a lot by state.

Well, when I was in school, we started history in 4th grade-that was North Carolina history. Fifth grade: North and South America. 6th-world history. 7th-politcs/world history. 8th-US history. 9th-civics and economics. 10th-world history. 11th-US history. 12th-European history, I think. In this part of the country, and when I was a student, it would have been hard to get to age 13 without knowing the Civil War basics. *But* my mother is a teacher, and she tells me that no one gets much history in the earlier grades anymore because it's not tested as much. Nowadays, her students ask her questions such as, "Were you alive during the Civil War?" In seriousness. (She's 57.)

[Kristin]

I'm seventeen. I have never attended public school, and my family doesn't use any particular curriculum in our homeschooling. Some of my textbooks may have used the word antebellum (especially the earlier, more America-centric ones), but if so it didn't stick in my memory.

Ah, okay. Sorry about that. Didn't realize. That'll teach me to make assumptions about the ages of people on the internet. Or about the educational background of people on the internet.

Didn't realize you were homeschooled either--I hope that didn't sound like a jab at *all* homeschooling. I'm wary of the Quiverfull/fundamentalist kind, but not all of it. If I had kids, I'd consider homeschooling them myself just 'cause I think the trend of all testing or practice testing all the time is really depressing and not conducive to independent thought.

[Kristin]

Those murder ballads are supposed to squick you out, kinda the horror movies of their day (only shorter)

And kind of a historic folk music trope. Gillian Welch and Dave Rawlings on "Wind and Rain," one of the old songs revived in the film, Songcatcher. These songs, as I understood it, were basically unchanged after immigrating from England:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5DeY3H1oaU

[Kestrelhill.wordpress.com]

My niece, about 10 at the time, was singing and bopping along to some song about tractors.
(Just googled to check the lyrics. It's "International Harvester" by Craig Morgan.)

She belted out:
"I’m the son of a third generation farmer
I’ve been married 10 years to the farmer’s daughter,"
and my slightly-older son asked, "Isn't that incest?"

My inlaws were NOT amused.

[P J Evans]

@ Kristin

For me: 4th grade, California history; 5th grade, US history (basic version); 6th grade, western hemisphere; 7th grade, world history (basic version); 8th grade, US history and government; 9th grade, world geography and miscellaneous ('state') requirements (like classroom-only driver ed, and we watched a lot of movies about WW2); 10th grade, world history; 11th grade - I forget what we had that year, actually (it was a year of school that I've mostly forgotten); 12th grade, civics and government.
And then you go off to college, if you're lucky, and you get a year of US history, with the bits that you hadn't met before added in.