A New Day

We'd originally planned to post this on Friday to give everyone time to comment, but as there's clearly some effort in the threads to come up with some new systems, we think this might be a good time to suggest our ideas a day early, as we think it might fit in very well with what people are saying. We must first assure people that nothing will be done that breaches confidentiality and every effort shall be made to preserve posts and comments. Also, thanks to the people who are volunteering, and particular thanks to those who acknowledged all the hard work we've done over the last year and a half.

Looking at the amount of volunteering, it looks like there are still some possibilities left, but the move is towards more communal writing and, looking at how much people say they could do, it doesn't look as if we could maintain the blog at the levels of content it was set up for (especially because real life always intervenes and illnesses, family business, work crises and so on mean that there are always a proportion of contributors able to write less than they'd planned).

In addition, we know from exhausting experience (and you all know from frustrating experience) that handling roundtables with TBAT as coordinators can take ages, and to be honest, we're burned out on that process. If people want to work together, there's no reason why they should have to go through us; it would be a lot less unwieldy.

So, it looks as if the proposed plans are something better handled by the community as a whole than by us as organisers - which fits in with what we've all been feeling lately, which is that we'd like to move on to other projects. We believe it was the right thing to do to withdraw from commenting on this blog - changing from regular commentariat members to administrator-editor-mods was a very problematic way of taking on mod status, and the repercussions were probably never going to go away no matter what we did (off-board, there was drama about it right from the beginning, well before any open controversies, and again, we've just had our fill of it) - but it's pretty unrewarding for us to simply edit and code-crunch on a blog we can't join the conversations on. We'd like to call it quits, part friends, and wish everyone else the best of luck in making something out of it.

So, here's what we want to do: hand over to a more community-based approach.

Here's how we think it could best be done technically:

1. Handing over the 'keys' to this place would, given some of the confidences we've received since beginning here, create some serious privacy problems. Shutting it down entirely, on the other hand, would lose everyone's posts and comments, and leave old-timers looking for this place lost. It would, though, be technically doable to freeze this place as an archive with a redirecting link at the top, which would avoid both problems. Were it frozen, it wouldn't require any more money to maintain.

2. We can set up a new place for the community that allows for a more broad-based way of editing and contributing content. Depending on how people choose to organise themselves in the future, we could either set it up for newly-selected moderators or have it open to contributing content from whoever asks us to e-mail them the password. (Assuming they're known community members, obviously, not just any old troll.)

3. We think we should move to system that doesn't require donations (in other words, something free), as that gives everyone a level playing field and removes the ticking clock that financial pressures can create. Again, this is perfectly doable.

4. Some of the other things suggested could be done very easily (for example, suggestion boxes and prompt lists.)

5. The community will decide amongst itself whether it wants to elect one or more new organisers or proceed on a more open platform. Should you want to have an election, we can put up voting buttons if needed.

So, to sum up: TBAT is resigning, wishing everyone the best. Nothing is perfect, but we'll help you set up a new system that should avoid most of the potential problems of a hand-over and can be tailored to your preferences before we go.

---

 

The Board Administration Team
(hapax, Kit Whitfield and mmy)

Comments

[Nenya]

I'm very sad to hear we will be losing you, though it is your ability to feel comfortable commenting here that I miss most. I'm sorry this whole thing has exhausted you so much. You don't deserve that.

That said--I think setting up a new place for people to talk is probably the way to go. That way you get some rest, and people can still keep talking.

[Nenya]

As for a new platform, as a long-time user of the LiveJournal/Dreamwidth style of blogging, may I suggest a Slacktivist Dreamwidth or LJ community?

[cjmr]

Of those two, I'd vote for LJ, since I'm already there and under the same handle.

[Nenya]

I know a lot of us already have LJs, and it is also possible to allow anonymous comments (and in the case of DW, to allow people with a LJ to comment using their LJ handle, I believe).

[kisekileia]

I agree with Nenya. I'm very sorry that the situation ended up so bad that you don't feel you can return to the community, TBAT, and I'm sorry I contributed to that.

I like LiveJournal/Dreamwidth, and they're great for privacy. Another possibility, although I don't know what free platforms are available for it, would be a forum. Forum mods aren't as likely to be seen as directly responsible for every new thing someone posts as blog mods, I think. A forum would also solve the content generation problem, because people could start new threads whenever they wanted. An LJ/Dreamwidth community would also let whoever feels like it post new content whenever they feel like it, but I think people tend to feel the bar is a bit higher for an LJ community post than for a forum post. But either would probably work.

[Amaryllis]

@TBAT: I don't blame you in the least, and I'd like to thank you for all your hard work. It was a good try, and you all carried on with it above and beyond what could have been asked of you.

Other than that, I don't know what to say, so I'll go on saying nothing.

[Anonymus]

Thank you for all your hard work and for being my friend.

[chris the cynic]

I also want to thank you for all your work, and for the support you've shown me.

[Phoenix]

Yes, thank you seems insufficient for all your hard work but it must be said regardless. This has been a long time coming. You've all given us more than a year of hard, unpaid labor and it's time for a well-earned rest.

I'd never have come so far in my understanding about rape culture (among many, many other topics but that one has become the most important to me) if it weren't for this blog, and writing my piece with April. TBAT was wonderful during that process, which was more of an emotional struggle than either April or I anticipated.

I owe you all a great debt.

[Will Wildman]

I haven't been a regular in some time, but I want to give a cheer for hapax, Kit Whitfield, and mmy. You have done great things here, taken on far more than I expect anyone realised they were asking for when this all began, and your relief from this work will be well-deserved. I will look forward to seeing you elsewhere on the web.

[DragonessEclectic]

I'd vote for Dreamwidth, because LiveJournal has repeatedly demonstrated they cannot be trusted with privacy and security issues. Also, the parent organization of LJ is based in a country that does not have quite the same consumer and privacy protection laws that the EU or even the U.S. does.

That, and do you really want your community to be inaccessible every time the Russians have an election? DDOSing Russian political activists is a semi-annual event on Livejournal.

[Izzy]

Thank you all again, and I hope we can keep in touch somehow. You guys are great.

[Dash]

Like Will Wildman, I haven't been a regular participant for quite a while, although I have been checking in whenever I could. I can't think of much to say besides repeating what has been said: TBAT did an incredible amount of work under what turned out to be very difficult circumstances and provided a community to those who needed it. They should be proud of that.

To respond to a comment from the other thread, I don't know how much extra money there will be, but if people will forgive a suggestion from an irregular: TBAT spent a lot of their own money keeping the blog going. They only put in the "donate" button towards the end. Unless Rupert Murdoch's otherwise unknown liberal son/daughter has been on the blog and tossed a couple million into the pot, I don't imagine there will be much there. My suggestion would be for TBAT to divide it among themselves. Chances are very good that it won't come close to reimbursing them for the money they spent paying the monthly fee to keep the blog going.

[chris the cynic]

I don't know where we should move.

I think it worth noting that in the other thread Ross highlighted facebook, livejournal and dreamwidth as things that can't be checked during work for him.

Also worthy of note is that blogger has recently moved to an interface that is capable of causing physical pain to it's users. (Though there is hope that fiddling on the user end might be able to resolve this since the company end has refused to give a damn.)

I really know nothing of platforms in general or particular.

-

hapax, Kit Whitfield, mmy, I've been missing you for a while, and I'm sure I'll miss you more in the future. I hope we meet again elsewhere. Maybe at Ana's since I feel like I've seen you all there at one time or another, maybe elsewhere. I don't like goodbyes, but I especially don't like, "I'll never see you again"s.

You've all made my life better, I hope that I've done the same for you to at least some degree.

Thank you all for everything, both what you have done as members of TBAT and as individuals.

[anamardoll]

I don't know what to say. Thank you for everything, for all you've done, for being so kind to me. I am sad that this has happened, but I am happy that you will have more pleasing projects to focus on. I do understand that, so much.

Thank you, thank you, thank you, for all that you've done and all that you've weathered in order to provide, maintain, and now freeze-in-time this lovely safe-space for us. Thank you a thousand times over.

[MercuryBlue]

I'd just like to point out that, much as I love Dreamwidth, it threads comments. I remember people here (actually probably on Patheos, but it was the same people) being very annoyed with threaded comments. There's a flat-view option, which displays all comments in chronological order with no threading, but as I recall that's an individual-opt-in rather than something a journal owner or comm mod can set (and possibly the opt-in only works on one entry at a time, I don't know, I don't like flat view), and I can't remember if there's a link from a flat comment to the comment it's a reply to. Probably is, but I forget.

LJ also threads comments. I do not believe it has a flat view. And somebody mentioned the privacy/security issues and the DDoSes. If we want LJ, we really want Dreamwidth instead, it's better on all points; if we only want LJ because we have LJ accounts and not Dreamwidth accounts, LJ accounts work on Dreamwidth (sign in with OpenID) and Dreamwidth basic accounts are free.

Kit, mmy, hapax, best wishes.

[Timothy (TRiG)]

Ah, I was just going to say something similar, but my session had expired, I had to refresh first, and saw that you'd already said it. After the mess with threaded comments at Patehos!Slacktivist, it was pointed out that threaded comments don't work well for group discussions, though they apparently do work well for some other types of conversation. I don't think a model with threaded comments would suit us at all.

I think WordPress.com accepts OpenID logins. I know WordPress.org can, with plugins, but that would not be a free option.

TRiG.

[Timothy (TRiG)]

I've just checked, and it seems they don't. Annoying.

WordPress.com is a blogging site (free). WordPress.org is a site where you can download the software to set up your own blogging site. Also free, but would require paying for a domain name and hosting. WordPress.org has OpenID plugins, but I've so far been unable to find one I'm happy with. It's possible that WordPress.com also allows OpenID logins, and it just so happens that every single one of the blogs I've checked has disabled that option, but I doubt it.

TRiG.

[kisekileia]

Is anyone on LJ/Dreamwidth who I don't already have friended? I'm kisekileia on there too. I don't update often, but I read almost everything.

[kisekileia]

I read almost everything on LJ, that is. Sorry. I need to start reading Dreamwidth more.

[Leum]

If we can avoid a place with threaded comments, I would be very happy. They aren't at all conducive to forming any sort of community.

[Nenya]

Hmm, I wouldn't say threaded comments preclude community: I've been in several very lively communities that use them. In my experience it's the *change* from nonthreaded to threaded (or, more rarely, vice versa) that causes trouble.

I am personally very comfortable with Dreamwidth/LJ, but if others aren't, then we should go with something that does work for us all. There are a lot of free messageboard hosts out there, for one thing.

[Nenya]

Example of a messageboard forum I've used: http://forum.shejidan.net/index.php There are sections for different types of discussions, and anyone who makes a (free) account can start a new thread or comment on old ones.

Don't know if something like that would work for us.

[Nenya]

I'm nenya_kanadka at LJ & DW, and have six or eight of you all friended. There may be folk I'm missing.

[Stalin]

Oh no! I hope that before you freeze everything, you get a chance to post the atheist roundtable.

[The Board Administration Team]

@Stalin: it has already been posted here:

http://slacktivist.typepad.com/slacktivist/2012/08/an-atheist-roundtable.html

[cjmr]

I have the same handle at LJ as I do here, and I know I don't have most of you friended. I don't post a lot though, and it is usually kid pictures and kid stories.

I have not been able to get the OpenID at DW to work consistently with my LJ, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. So if we go to DW, I will probably get a DW account, too.